Hypothetical Uwaffa b*ll*x

[Ted Hughes]

Socrates - really admire your strength of character - in the face of so much head in the sand

No - there would be no money to be made if Sheik was to.... - because the TV companies would have already been in deep contract agreement with the old G14 clubs - there would be no one to play in this Sheik league

People just cannot get their heads around the seriousness - and the reality of the proposals

It is not just some Socs agenda - UeFA and the top g14 clubs have been so explicit about their plans - all this 2...the Sheik could do this..." or "...the Sheik could do that...." is just playground stuff to avoid the reality of what is being planned


Reality (IMO) is the name would be changed from Champions League - perhaps - "European League" with big deal done with SKY and others

qualification through individual country leagues would be a thing of the past (Perez has already been clear on this) - (the risk of which is why they will bottle it an support the proposals) etc etc - they is no rival Sheik league unless it is with Feyenoord, Wolsfburg, Rapid Vienna, Racing Santander and a couple of others - the TV rights will be queuing up for that!!

Far from burying heads in sand a lot of us can see that what Platini proposes is something that he is not going to be able to implement.Some watered down version of his ideas is as far as he will be able to get.
And what contracts do the G14 clubs have with SKY and the other European media companies cos I thought they had contracts with the leagues of the countries in the CL.Not individual clubs.What contract do Sky have with RM.They dont.So if these big formerly G14 clubs make their "Europa League" that is unlikely to be sanctioned by Uefa the media companies are under no contract to them and more than likely the G14 clubs will lose of major revenue stream if they form a break-away league.

1/ those with the money - TV companies
2/ those with the product - clubs at the end of the day - not leagues (although that is the case at the moment where there is a collective agreement)
3/ brokers / middle men / agents (I do not mean football agents) etc - UeFA - national leagues etc



...nothing I see going on here than just normal business practice - we need our seat at the table (IMO)

There is a whole world of so far untapped revenue including the rest of the world outside Europe. Not just tv but other media. Our people were already on this when Frank was at the club & the Sheikh is a whole universe ahead of him with contacts, partnerships & assets in the media business not just in football but all sports (they just built a F1 racetrack for similar money than it'd cost to buy the PL for a year, that's a track that gets used how many times per year? It's part of a $40 bn development including a Ferrari theme park) Do UEFA or the EU really want to alienate these blokes or would a more sensible action not be to let them get on with it as partners rather than turn them into competitors?

[Socrates]

Ted, there's not as much untapped revenue as you think - well not yet anyway. Sure Asian countries, in particular, are Premier League mad but beyond watching on tv and betting on it they aren't willing, or able, to spend money on it. Take Thailand as the prime example - everywhere you go you see Thais wearing EPL football shirts but you can bet your last baht that more than 99% of them won't be official merchandise! One day as countries get richer that percentage may improve but I'm not sure by how much...

[mcfc1632]

I think that there is a lot of agreement here - even if it might look as if there are sides - for those of us in what I will call the 'Socs camp' - it is just a question of recognising that there is a 'movement' to protect certain powerful self-interests - but this does not mean that we should not still do all those things that are suggested by the 'Ted / RH camp' to increase revenues - use financial and political muscles etc - and equally the other way around

We just need to do things aggressively on all fronts - our management seem well onto it - it is for these reason I remain positive about Cook - I would rather not have the PR cock-ups (for me the Kaka thing was AC not him - glad he had the balls to tell it as it was) - but the big commercial stuff is far more important to me

[Ted Hughes]

Ted, there's not as much untapped revenue as you think - well not yet anyway. Sure Asian countries, in particular, are Premier League mad but beyond watching on tv and betting on it they aren't willing, or able, to spend money on it. Take Thailand as the prime example - everywhere you go you see Thais wearing EPL football shirts but you can bet your last baht that more than 99% of them won't be official merchandise! One day as countries get richer that percentage may improve but I'm not sure by how much...

It only needs a very small percentage to be able to buy stuff though & not just in Asia. There are a lot of people in the world! . Talksport were talking to their Canadian correspondant & he casually mentioned one of the players of some dodgy Canadian sport, dunno which one, was on a $100M contract. That's for a sport most of the world isn't even interested in. They must be earning a few quid to pay a player that much.

The present football deals are underselling the top clubs by a long way because they're subsidising everyone else. That's what frightens Platini & that's why imo he won't want to make enemies of people who could buy & sell the whole thing out of loose change. It's not just Berlusconi he needs to be nice to.

[Ted Hughes]

I think that there is a lot of agreement here - even if it might look as if there are sides - for those of us in what I will call the 'Socs camp' - it is just a question of recognising that there is a 'movement' to protect certain powerful self-interests - but this does not mean that we should not still do all those things that are suggested by the 'Ted / RH camp' to increase revenues - use financial and political muscles etc - and equally the other way around

We just need to do things aggressively on all fronts - our management seem well onto it - it is for these reason I remain positive about Cook - I would rather not have the PR cock-ups (for me the Kaka thing was AC not him - glad he had the balls to tell it as it was) - but the big commercial stuff is far more important to me

Agree about Cook but why the fuck does he have to speak?

[Rag_hater]

Socrates - really admire your strength of character - in the face of so much head in the sand

No - there would be no money to be made if Sheik was to.... - because the TV companies would have already been in deep contract agreement with the old G14 clubs - there would be no one to play in this Sheik league

People just cannot get their heads around the seriousness - and the reality of the proposals

It is not just some Socs agenda - UeFA and the top g14 clubs have been so explicit about their plans - all this 2...the Sheik could do this..." or "...the Sheik could do that...." is just playground stuff to avoid the reality of what is being planned


Reality (IMO) is the name would be changed from Champions League - perhaps - "European League" with big deal done with SKY and others

qualification through individual country leagues would be a thing of the past (Perez has already been clear on this) - (the risk of which is why they will bottle it an support the proposals) etc etc - they is no rival Sheik league unless it is with Feyenoord, Wolsfburg, Rapid Vienna, Racing Santander and a couple of others - the TV rights will be queuing up for that!!

Far from burying heads in sand a lot of us can see that what Platini proposes is something that he is not going to be able to implement.Some watered down version of his ideas is as far as he will be able to get.
And what contracts do the G14 clubs have with SKY and the other European media companies cos I thought they had contracts with the leagues of the countries in the CL.Not individual clubs.What contract do Sky have with RM.They dont.So if these big formerly G14 clubs make their "Europa League" that is unlikely to be sanctioned by Uefa the media companies are under no contract to them and more than likely the G14 clubs will lose of major revenue stream if they form a break-away league.

1/ those with the money - TV companies
2/ those with the product - clubs at the end of the day - not leagues (although that is the case at the moment where there is a collective agreement)
3/ brokers / middle men / agents (I do not mean football agents) etc - UeFA - national leagues etc



...nothing I see going on here than just normal business practice - we need our seat at the table (IMO)

There is a whole world of so far untapped revenue including the rest of the world outside Europe. Not just tv but other media. Our people were already on this when Frank was at the club & the Sheikh is a whole universe ahead of him with contacts, partnerships & assets in the media business not just in football but all sports (they just built a F1 racetrack for similar money than it'd cost to buy the PL for a year, that's a track that gets used how many times per year? It's part of a $40 bn development including a Ferrari theme park) Do UEFA or the EU really want to alienate these blokes or would a more sensible action not be to let them get on with it as partners rather than turn them into competitors?

I'd say your spot on there about the EU and Uefa being wise not to challenge our Sheikh to vigourously as he is in a strong enough position to put up a robust fight.
Also there may only be a small legitimate market in places like Thailand,however it is still a market and there are fewer competitors for the shares of that market which are available, so capturing what small part of it there might be could prove to be lucrative.And also places in Asia which are richer like Japan and Singapore the market for the EPL can be exploited with the payments and rewards being significant enough to make it profitable.Also in the Middle-East, a rich part of the world I should imagine there is mountains of wealth for us to tap into.

[john68]

RH,
You seem to missing a very basic point. The cartel clubs have the political and financial clout, UeFA are being pushed into a corner and this is their way of keeping the cartel clubs under their banner and within their organisation.

This is NOT new, it has all been done before. When the cartel clubs made their demands some years ago, they threatened to break away and set up their own league. UeFA reacted by restructering the Euro Cup into the CL and ensured that the cartel clubs got everything they wanted. The financial rules were changed and all this was to the detriment of every club in Europe outside the cartel and England, Spain, Italy and Germany. The wishes of those thousands of clubs, either together or in isolation were simply ignored.

Rugby League set up SuperLeague, not once but twice...to the detriment of the whole of the rest of Rugby League. Of the 100s of clubs, only the wishes of the chosen few were taken into consideration.

The Premier League itself broke away against the interests of every other club in England. The FA merely fell into line.

When the cartel clubs shout "shit"...rest assured that UeFA...the media (in all its forms), the sponsors and just aboput everyone else involved in football...will simply jump on the shovel...
Unfair, unjust...but inevitable.

[mcfc1632]

Spot on John - and what I have been saying is the noises from RM and the other cartel clubs are simply the early statements - Platini sort it out for us - or else...