Food For Thought...Do We?

[sandman]

2. They will not want to come to Eastlands yet anyway (instant success is more attractive than our project)

Well they ain't gonna get instant success where they currently are so it may be an attractive move for them all of a sudden

Players of that calibre will not only have two options, its not us or Liverpool, bigger and better clubs than Liverpool will also come in!!

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

I'd love Liverpool's plight to continue, but I have the feeling that at some point the two septics will sell. Possibly to an incredibly rich arab and they will have their problems solved at a stroke. On the other hand, where as we were quite cheap to buy, there will be massive money involved at Scouse right from the outset. Maybe makes them a less attractive proposition than they should be.

[ant london]

I'd love Liverpool's plight to continue, but I have the feeling that at some point the two septics will sell. Possibly to an incredibly rich arab and they will have their problems solved at a stroke. On the other hand, where as we were quite cheap to buy, there will be massive money involved at Scouse right from the outset. Maybe makes them a less attractive proposition than they should be.

very true Piccs

Thing is, if the Yanks hadn't bought at pretty much the worst possible time.....ie one when the credit market collapsed (so their financing of the club/potential new stadium became fraught/impossible to negotiate) and the value of their other (leveraged) assets dropped through the floor Liverpool wouldn't be in the pickle they find themselves in

But the truth of the matter is, as you rightly say, in order for someone to come in and refinance the club (or ideally clear the debts) and provide funds for development (of stadium and squad) and also provide the sell-on margin that Hicks/Gillette will likely want....well, that will need deep pockets and the attractiveness of the deal actually diminishes hugely.

What will actually probably be more beneficial for the club (albeit it will be much more unpleasant for fans in the short/medium term) would be for them to bomb out of Europe, miss the CL next season....leading to a big dip in the value of the club meaning that H&G have to cut their losses just to get out....sell at a loss and the overall investment made by a new owner will provide the club with some funds rather than just lining the Americans' pockets

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

As ever Ant, it's wise words.
In many ways Filth are the same. To wipe the debts and buy the club would be astronomical. I look at Newcastle as the club that looks most ripe to be bought, I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.

[ant london]

As ever Ant, it's wise words.
In many ways Filth are the same. To wipe the debts and buy the club would be astronomical. I look at Newcastle as the club that looks most ripe to be bought, I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.

Yeah they are certainly the one who is most like City (pre-Sheikh) and with the most potential for increase in value

I am pretty certain that the reason no-one has got involved there is twofold 1) there are quite significant debts and 2) the value that Ashley wants (more specifically the profit he wants to exit with) is unreasonable in light of 1).

In terms of his own strategy, he's done the riskier (but potentially more profitable) thing of trying to get them back up at the first time of asking. It looks good for him so far.

The only thing I would say though is that he needs to have that deal lined up pre-promotion really. I can't see that he will want to commit further funds for players even if they are promoted so the new guys have to be in for the window....as if they don't invest in their squad methinks they shall be going straight back down again....and he's back to square one

[sandman]

As ever Ant, it's wise words.
In many ways Filth are the same. To wipe the debts and buy the club would be astronomical. I look at Newcastle as the club that looks most ripe to be bought, I'm surprised it hasn't happened already.

Totally agree, plus having as much available real estate available as their is in the surrounding areas of toon they have massive opportunities for redevelopment, transport facilities and new training facilities within one complex.

[Rag_hater]

This thread and quite a few comments in it suggesting we upset Dippers by putting cheeky bids makes me wonder why people get so upset and vitriolic towards Robbie when Barca (who are probably more experienced than us in these matters than us) do the same to us.

[ant london]

This thread and quite a few comments in it suggesting we upset Dippers by putting cheeky bids makes me wonder why people get so upset and vitriolic towards Robbie when Barca (who are probably more experienced than us in these matters than us) do the same to us.

Albeit that it's hopefully only a difference for a short space of time but you're not comparing apples with apples there mate

Liverpool are domestic rivals and we are both very explicitly competing for the same CL spot this year. Thus we nick a player off them or potentially just destabilise a direct rival by trying to buy their star player.

However, the key issue is that we can 100% definitely afford to stump up the cash for Fernando Torres. If he decided to leave Liverpool for City, Liverpool would be more than adequately compensated.

Barcelona on the other hand, well I doubt they actually have the 35million or so it would take to make us selling Robson an acceptable trade. They (or those purporting to act for them) have been destablilising our campaign and our star player with very little intention of or ability to purchase him for his fair market value.

They are, in short trying to get our best player and not pay us his worth.

The two situations are similar in some respects but wholly incomparable in their actual substance

[Twobob]

Kick them while they're down - has to be done!

[salford city]

I'm in the 'put the cheeky bids in' camp in an effort to de-stabilise them. Happened to us in any number of occasions. Doubt that it would work in this instance - however for the bean counters at Anfield it would be food for thought and my well cause further dis-ruption behind the scenes?

[Original Dub]

This thread and quite a few comments in it suggesting we upset Dippers by putting cheeky bids makes me wonder why people get so upset and vitriolic towards Robbie when Barca (who are probably more experienced than us in these matters than us) do the same to us.

Because we're Manchester City supporters and will defend our club against all others.

Won't we?

[Rag_hater]

This thread and quite a few comments in it suggesting we upset Dippers by putting cheeky bids makes me wonder why people get so upset and vitriolic towards Robbie when Barca (who are probably more experienced than us in these matters than us) do the same to us.

Albeit that it's hopefully only a difference for a short space of time but you're not comparing apples with apples there mate

Liverpool are domestic rivals and we are both very explicitly competing for the same CL spot this year. Thus we nick a player off them or potentially just destabilise a direct rival by trying to buy their star player.

However, the key issue is that we can 100% definitely afford to stump up the cash for Fernando Torres. If he decided to leave Liverpool for City, Liverpool would be more than adequately compensated.

Barcelona on the other hand, well I doubt they actually have the 35million or so it would take to make us selling Robson an acceptable trade. They (or those purporting to act for them) have been destablilising our campaign and our star player with very little intention of or ability to purchase him for his fair market value.

They are, in short trying to get our best player and not pay us his worth.

The two situations are similar in some respects but wholly incomparable in their actual substance

I'm happy to admit that I dont understand the financial intracassies of the matter as you will but its not that point that confuses me.
I dont understand why our fans are getting on Robbie's back whilst suggesting we do the same thing.
The situation with Torres is has only just begun because of the Dippers recent plight but if we propel the rumours everday for the next few weeks then they may cause disharmony amongst the Dippers fans as the Robbie rumours have with us.
It just seems to me that this is something big clubs do and now we are members of that clique it is something I suppose we should do.But conversly when it happens to us accept this is the territory we are now in with having such star players.

[Original Dub]

This thread and quite a few comments in it suggesting we upset Dippers by putting cheeky bids makes me wonder why people get so upset and vitriolic towards Robbie when Barca (who are probably more experienced than us in these matters than us) do the same to us.

Albeit that it's hopefully only a difference for a short space of time but you're not comparing apples with apples there mate

Liverpool are domestic rivals and we are both very explicitly competing for the same CL spot this year. Thus we nick a player off them or potentially just destabilise a direct rival by trying to buy their star player.

However, the key issue is that we can 100% definitely afford to stump up the cash for Fernando Torres. If he decided to leave Liverpool for City, Liverpool would be more than adequately compensated.

Barcelona on the other hand, well I doubt they actually have the 35million or so it would take to make us selling Robson an acceptable trade. They (or those purporting to act for them) have been destablilising our campaign and our star player with very little intention of or ability to purchase him for his fair market value.

They are, in short trying to get our best player and not pay us his worth.

The two situations are similar in some respects but wholly incomparable in their actual substance

I'm happy to admit that I dont understand the financial intracassies of the matter as you will but its not that point that confuses me.
I dont understand why our fans are getting on Robbie's back whilst suggesting we do the same thing.
The situation with Torres is has only just begun because of the Dippers recent plight but if we propel the rumours everday for the next few weeks then they may cause disharmony amongst the Dippers fans as the Robbie rumours have with us.
It just seems to me that this is something big clubs do and now we are members of that clique it is something I suppose we should do.But conversly when it happens to us accept this is the territory we are now in with having such star players.

Its because we're City fans mate.

Its like when you see someone trip up, sometimes you can't help but laugh... but if its one of your family its not that funny...

Dog eat dog, but our dog is City and the other dogs can fuck off, no?

[razor400]

Mrs Razor here. You all know I'm a Liverpool fan so of course i have to have my two pennys worth here lol. if hicks and Gillette have any hopes of continuing at liverpool then Torres and Gerrard must stay. It would be suicide for them to sell their 2 best players. Not to mention the absolute riot and I mean riot it would cause. The other thing you fail to spot is that Torres is not the typical player off the pitch. He doesn't court the lifestyle and took a pay cut to come to Liverpool in the first place. He's not the type to have his head turned. Gerrard is coming to his twilight years now and as much as I love him he will have played solid football for 2 years straight after next next season because of the World Cup and he's struggling now to cope. He no longer offers you a long term reward. We want to keep him because we love him but his influence will become less and less. As for destabilising the club, do you honestly think you could rock the boat anymore that it already is. Jesus we've practically capsized lol! We're taking on more water daily. If we don't get our arses back in the game and we miss next seasons CL then Torres remains our one big 'pull' for investment and potential buyers. It makes no business sense to get rid whatever the price because without him we have nothing viable to offer.

[Wonderwall]

Mrs Razor here. You all know I'm a Liverpool fan so of course i have to have my two pennys worth here lol. if hicks and Gillette have any hopes of continuing at liverpool then Torres and Gerrard must stay. It would be suicide for them to sell their 2 best players. Not to mention the absolute riot and I mean riot it would cause. The other thing you fail to spot is that Torres is not the typical player off the pitch. He doesn't court the lifestyle and took a pay cut to come to Liverpool in the first place. He's not the type to have his head turned. Gerrard is coming to his twilight years now and as much as I love him he will have played solid football for 2 years straight after next next season because of the World Cup and he's struggling now to cope. He no longer offers you a long term reward. We want to keep him because we love him but his influence will become less and less. As for destabilising the club, do you honestly think you could rock the boat anymore that it already is. Jesus we've practically capsized lol! We're taking on more water daily. If we don't get our arses back in the game and we miss next seasons CL then Torres remains our one big 'pull' for investment and potential buyers. It makes no business sense to get rid whatever the price because without him we have nothing viable to offer.

Nice post and I fully agree regarding Gerrard. If Wenger were in charge of Liverpool and we put a big bid in, he would sell as he has had the best out of him. However, Gerrard is the herart of liverpool and I cannot see him ever leaving the club under his own steam. It would be different if the club wanted to get rid.

Regarding your titanic, I think you are wobbling but you have not hit the iceberg yet. A win for everton this weekend will certainly cause uproar within the anfield corridors as the league position is coming under the most scrutiny now the CL has gone and every back page slimeball will be focusing on any negative they can get their grubby mits on. The worst thing Gillette and Hicks have done is give Benitez the new 5 yr contract 4 months ago, I bet they are kicking themselves now as they cannot afford to get rid of him.

[sky_blue_stew]

I can imagine Liverpool fans swallowing bleach if the media started spreading Torres-to-us rumours every which way. It's inevitably going to start anyway, as it'll naturally be assumed in the press that the best striker in the world won't be content with Europa League football, but a bid would certainly rock the boat. So in response to Mrs Razor, Liverpool might think things can't get much worse, but I think darker times lie before the light, even if it's just rough coverage in the press.

[ashton287]

I think we could do some business with Liverpool in January but I think the easiest way to trade with them would be player plus cash deals.

Give them the certainty of replacements in some areas with also some extra bunce to go out and recruit.

For example.....Micah Richards plus 15million for Glen Johnson

Or some players on loan for the rest of the season (Maybe Weiss, Petrov, Benjani) plus 60million for Torres

are you F#*KING kidding me richards + £15 million so johnson is worth what 30+ million go have a nap mate your obviously not well and theres no way liverpool will sell torres or gerrard mid season the main priority for them now is qualifying for CL next year because they cant go 2 seasons without the income i think babel would be a good buy and one that theyd consider hes already said hes not happy there and i think hes massivelly underated and could solve a few problems as he can play left and right so no more bellamy on the wing or asa replacement for shauny who even though hes my favourite player wont be playing for us in 1 maybe 2 seasons

[Vhero]

We could offer 100 mill for Torres and he wouldn't come I doubt it would even be accepted purely because of the amount of press they would get saying no to an offer like that. I am not saying they wouldn't want to say yes but in reality they couldn't the fans wouldn't allow it.

[Im_Spartacus]

I very much doubt Gerard will ever leave Liverpool, he would rather take a pay cut.

Torres on the other hand might. But Chelsea and Scum would be all over him if he became available, and no doubt he would head to Scum.

I asked him last September not long after the takeover what he thought of £250k/week wages that the papers were talking about with him and city.

His answer........

"What would you do?" With a big fuck off smile all over his face.

He would be over like a shot if he thought we could match his ambitions and Liverpool we sliding down the shitter - but its this year or not at all for me, as he is not getting any younger

[Mr Miyagi]

that glen johnson fella looks a bloody good player,

No he doesn't

he would solve a problem for us

No he wouldn't