Fans

[Beefymcfc]

Far too sensible, expect a kicking.

So Lev, apart from the rest of the post, that in the main, I agree with, are you saying that it is alright to lambast the crowd who have been watching these games, tactics and somewhat concerning choices of playing staff; is that what you are advocating?

As you being an ardent Blue, you will be well aware of the responses from the crowd on Saturday. So:

Were those dissenting voices at half time just coming from a small minority of supporters or was it reverberating around the ground?

When the chnage was made for Carlos, was it just a small minority who were astonished at what was taking place or was it the majority of the ground who stood up in defiance of what they were seeing?

If the answer is 'Yes', then that would suggest that the paying going public are starting to get really aggravated with our current set-up and therefore are starting to turn against the manager. If the answer is 'No', well, I'm not sure what to say

I've no idea whether the boos were from a majority or not, but there were lots of them. So, yes the paying public is getting fed up with what they see. I don't blame them for that. But, let's be honest this isn't the first time a City team has been booed. It was embarassing then - it's embarassing now. (I had a pal who was a steward in the Main Stand during the late 90s, they weren't called Main Stand Moaners for nothing, Saturday was a gentle ripple of dissatisfaction in comparison). If someone can give me one example of a team being improved by booing, then please tell me. There might be examples but I can't think of one.

Like it or not we start off from where we are not from where we'd like to be. We have a manager who believes he has identified weaknesses in our game from last year, that we gave too much away too cheaply. If that is his thinking then IMO he's damn right.
So, I'm guessing that he's trying to play a game where we are in control and give nothing away, hoping that in so doing we create enough chances to win games, if not then at least we get a draw.

Secondly, I think he believed that the mentality of many of the squad wasn't strong enough (right again) and he's trying to femedy it.

Do you know why Carlos was bought off - I certainly don't? He could have been carrying an injury and decided that he was flogging a dead horse and to save him for a better day (which is what Platt seemed to be getting at). He could have decided that Carlos wasn't linking play as he should so sought an answer. He could have thought that Carlos's hair style was rubbish and brought him off to save the club from further embarrassment. Who knows? Nobody who was booing did either, so as far as I'm concerned it was a knee-jerk reaction and deserves criticism.

Now I grant you, we aren't pretty and we are boring many people. But grant me a couple of things in return, we've got a manager who is working to improve our station in life, who also identifies problems and tries to put it right, so let's all just chill out, cut the guy some slack and let him get on with doing his job.

I don't really see that we disagree in many ways and I'm certainly not advocating that what happened on Saturday is right, what I am saying is that it did happen and that gives me concerns on how the players will perceive the current manager. Carlos came off after seemingly asking Mancio for some help up-front, not gesturing to come off from where I was watching. However, we do know that he has been carrying a knock for a few weeks now so Mancio decided he was just treading water, Platt has also stated that it was a precautionary measure. I honestly don't think it was the Carlos off that wound people up, but the Barry on, and the worse thing for me was that out of all our squad, there was no real attacking player on the bench and the only player who I felt would get a cross in had already been subbed for the player who could get on the end of them.

And you are right, we have had booing since I've been following City, and Saturday was nowhere near has it could be. But, those knee-jerk reactions are there for a purpose and whether you like it or not it is concerning, especially when our team needs a pick-me-up. If the same sort of game-play continues we'll see much more of it as the bottle has been opened now, and unless Mancio and the team start improving on performances, the bottle will be just pressurised even more.

2 away games now, probably a blessing in disguise to be honest.

[Lev Bronstein]

seriously though, the booing really did make me feel uncomfortable. i have never and will never boo any city player or side, i just don't understand it. if people want to do it then ok, you pay yer cash so do what you like.

I can't make up my mind about satdi, we were pretty shite in the first half but had the brummie twats pinned back in the second - the point someone made about the reaction had three or even two goals gone in is a pretty valid one. But - and this is a big, fuck-off but - we have had this problem since Hughes' first season. We are known as a pretty potent attacking side on our day and most teams - including the so called biggest club in the world - have and will come to park the bus.

Why havn't we learnt to deal with this?

I suppose it's a back handed compliment in that we are seen to be one of the top clubs and teams have to play that way against us.

The first answer I can think of is to take your chances. If (oh, how I hate using that word) Carlos's goal had been allowed of Milner's not been cleared off the line then it would've been problem solved.

The second answer is to create more chances.

The third answer is to remind referees of our enhanced staus and badger them to give us a pen or 58 mins of extra time. Not that the "top" clubs" rely on such things - they just seem to get them when needed.

[Ted Hughes]

I sincerely hope that this piss poor brand of football we're currently witnessing is all part of the bedding in period, part of a long term plan to develop a winning mentality throughout the club. I'm willing to accept this on the proviso that in order to become a great team you need a solid defensive foundation. This, I believe, is where we are currently at.

That's exactly where I think we are...I'm sure I heard before Bobby came that he was quite an attacking Manager at previous clubs...could be wrong

Imo he was a very changeable manager, like he has been at City. Lots of different systems. Quite a few games I saw he went very long ball, whacking it up to Ibra with the defence very deep. I wasn't impressed with his Inter team at all tbh & think Mourinho completely outclassed him in the way he raised their standard. Now under Rafa, they look like Mancini's team again, only worse. This doesn't make me think Mancini is a bad manager but it has convinced me, reluctantly, with hindsight, that I was wrong about Mourinho & the bloke is a class above.


Regarding the question 'will everyone be happy if we play like this & finish 4th?' we won't finish 4th playing like that. We're where we are because of the good performances & a couple of lucky ones. We won't even get top 6 if we play like we did in the last 2, we need to be much better.

[saulman]

Agree with OP 100%. On Saturday, it was like they'd let in an army of knobs.

[s1ty m]

I spend thousands of pounds supporting this club, so I believe I do a lot for them as it is John. 400+ miles this last week to watch the worst football I have seen by any side in this league for some years. Orig Dub is right, they do not have to play this way to get 4th.

The league is wide open. Yesterdays Chelsea result made me even more angry; we should go for title, balls out. He won't, he's scared. He should go. Same points haul as the useless Hughes, for a measly £140 million outlay. He should be ashamed.

[Beefymcfc]

Agree with OP 100%. On Saturday, it was like they'd let in an army of knobs.

Whooooo, an Army of Knobs. Does that mean that there were loads and loads and loads and loads of them?

[Kladze]

ust admit that I hope it doesn't degenerate into the mud slinging stuff we saw last season. So far it hasn't, except for that cheeky Aussie cunt Dazby calling me a twat yesterday ;-)

Must admit, he makes a decent point though ;-)

Watch it sunshine! ;-)

[Nick]

Fans need to realise that the game at City has changed over the last two seasons. The way opposing managers and players looked at us has changed beyond recognition.

The Past.

City are shite. if you work hard and keep it tight for twenty or thirty minutes, you can shut the crowd up and then pick them off once the crowd turn on their own. They have no players of any real talent. They are hard-working enough but ultimately a soft touch. Any game at City is potentially a piece of piss. Any team can go there and win.

Now.

City have got two or three players that might just get into a World XI. If you go there, you need to defend properly, preferably in numbers, and deny their creative players any space at all to work in. If they get space, they score. They don't make a lot of chances but the ones they do make they generally put away. In short they are a highly efficient outfit. This means that you MUST NOT make mistakes. If by chance you do make one, we need to have plenty of cover to hope to retrieve the situation. Therefore I want to see all of you focussing on defence. Counter attack quickly if you get the chance, but this is going to be hard as their defensive five don't get forward a great deal. A draw is probably the best we can get here, though the fickleness of their fans is starting to become an issue again as they may start to get on the backs of their players if the conditions are right. This may be our best chance but it is only possible if we keep their top players under control.

Now this clearly has repercussions for fans.

Anyone going expecting to see 11-goal thrillers is going to be disappointed. Key point coming up. This is not always City's fault.

The opposition come to stifle us. It is a compliment. It means they are scared of us because we are good. It results in porr games mopst of the time. This does not mean we are shite, or that our players are shite, or that our manager is shite. It means the oppostion are scared and know that they need to be at their very, very best defensively to get anything other than a defeat. You might not like me saying this, but we are now in the position that liverpool were in thirty years ago or that united were in ten years ago. Poor matches are not totally City's fault. Sometimes the other team play well. This is the nature of sport. Think how many shit matches the crowds at the fleapit or Anfield have had to sit through becasue the opposition have no other ambition than to just stifle the home team. Did they moan like fuck about it? No they didn't. They backed their team like fans are supposed to do. They don't go around wanting to sack their manager simply because they've a had a couple of fucking goalless draws.

What fans need to do is understand this and still get behind the team. Despite all the high salaries and the money being spent and the lack of players that we can identify with, the role of the fan has changed in only one respect - we now need a bit more patience than we had before. Other than that our job is no different. We still need to go to the games and make some fucking noise. Make the place intimidating like it used to be on derby day when we were shit.

Right.

Anyone who goes to the game not prepared to sing themselves hoarse for the cause can fuck off to the Opera House.

Anyone who thinks we have got a divine right to play free-flowing football and win 12-0 every fucking week is a gibbering idiot who fails to grasp the reality of today's professional game.

Anyone who wants to sack the manager when the club is in its current position, a league place higher than we have finished for the last 33 years and joint top of our group in Europe, is a fucking cretin who has shown that they are thick enough to believe what they read in the media.

Best fans in the world? God's own club? Fucking bollocks. Sort your fucking selves out and start behaving like proper football fans instead of spoilt fucking babies.

Spot on. Although I would say a large percentage of fans at COMS never went to Maine Road. There a shit loads of day trippers, non fans etc. that simply dont get involved or support the team. On the other hand, on saturday, there was also many true blues signing against Mancini and booing him. Something which I do not agree with.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

[Nick]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

Its true that every time we've hammered united we have had injuries / suspendsions and played patched up sides. We now have the quality players and are not beating United. Maybe something to do with hunger? Fear?

Teams with Mettomo and Macken in it just went for it. I want a Hinch or a Trev to score and really give the United fans some shit!

[brite blu sky]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

Its true that every time we've hammered united we have had injuries / suspendsions and played patched up sides. We now have the quality players and are not beating United. Maybe something to do with hunger? Fear?

Teams with Mettomo and Macken in it just went for it. I want a Hinch or a Trev to score and really give the United fans some shit!

I really feel it was a bit of a one off that game, both teams not wanting to lose and no-one wanting to make a mistake. The rags put more effort in though, that was plain and annoying.
I did think right after the game that the return at the swamp will suit us better.

Sometimes in footie small unnoticed details like one extra day recovery can make a difference, not sure if that is the case for them looking like they had more energy but you never know.

I do think as i say they will be more than a bit worried at the return game. 4 pts off them would be ok.

[Arjan Van Schotte]

like the players actually give a flying fuck about the fans.

unless they're buying the merch.

[Original Dub]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

Its true that every time we've hammered united we have had injuries / suspendsions and played patched up sides. We now have the quality players and are not beating United. Maybe something to do with hunger? Fear?

Teams with Mettomo and Macken in it just went for it. I want a Hinch or a Trev to score and really give the United fans some shit!

I really feel it was a bit of a one off that game, both teams not wanting to lose and no-one wanting to make a mistake. The rags put more effort in though, that was plain and annoying.
I did think right after the game that the return at the swamp will suit us better.

Sometimes in footie small unnoticed details like one extra day recovery can make a difference, not sure if that is the case for them looking like they had more energy but you never know.

I do think as i say they will be more than a bit worried at the return game. 4 pts off them would be ok.

It wasn't a one off, I sat through the exact same shit in the exact same tie last season. Last time we had 11 defenders on the pitch and one of them switched off towards the end. This time we held out. Terrified of the opposition, but we held out.

We did the same thing against Arsenal last season too.

We're going over it an over it, but the fact is that we HAVE to be more ambitious. The whole fucking footballing world can see it and if Mancini doesn't spot it soon, he WILL lose his job IMO.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

Its true that every time we've hammered united we have had injuries / suspendsions and played patched up sides. We now have the quality players and are not beating United. Maybe something to do with hunger? Fear?

Teams with Mettomo and Macken in it just went for it. I want a Hinch or a Trev to score and really give the United fans some shit!

I really feel it was a bit of a one off that game, both teams not wanting to lose and no-one wanting to make a mistake. The rags put more effort in though, that was plain and annoying.
I did think right after the game that the return at the swamp will suit us better.

Sometimes in footie small unnoticed details like one extra day recovery can make a difference, not sure if that is the case for them looking like they had more energy but you never know.

I do think as i say they will be more than a bit worried at the return game. 4 pts off them would be ok.

It wasn't a one off, I sat through the exact same shit in the exact same tie last season. Last time we had 11 defenders on the pitch and one of them switched off towards the end. This time we held out. Terrified of the opposition, but we held out.

We did the same thing against Arsenal last season too.

We're going over it an over it, but the fact is that we HAVE to be more ambitious. The whole fucking footballing world can see it and if Mancini doesn't spot it soon, he WILL lose his job IMO.

Agreed. I can stomach playing crap and boring if we lose and I can stomach losing if we've given it a real good go but I cannot accept playing with zero ambition.

Then the arguement thrown about will be " would you rather play entertaining football or be succesfull?"
I really don't get it, people make out like the two are mutually exclusive and you have to sacrifice one for the other?

[Blue Since 76]

Fans need to realise that the game at City has changed over the last two seasons. The way opposing managers and players looked at us has changed beyond recognition.

The Past.

City are shite. if you work hard and keep it tight for twenty or thirty minutes, you can shut the crowd up and then pick them off once the crowd turn on their own. They have no players of any real talent. They are hard-working enough but ultimately a soft touch. Any game at City is potentially a piece of piss. Any team can go there and win.

Now.

City have got two or three players that might just get into a World XI. If you go there, you need to defend properly, preferably in numbers, and deny their creative players any space at all to work in. If they get space, they score. They don't make a lot of chances but the ones they do make they generally put away. In short they are a highly efficient outfit. This means that you MUST NOT make mistakes. If by chance you do make one, we need to have plenty of cover to hope to retrieve the situation. Therefore I want to see all of you focussing on defence. Counter attack quickly if you get the chance, but this is going to be hard as their defensive five don't get forward a great deal. A draw is probably the best we can get here, though the fickleness of their fans is starting to become an issue again as they may start to get on the backs of their players if the conditions are right. This may be our best chance but it is only possible if we keep their top players under control.

Now this clearly has repercussions for fans.

Anyone going expecting to see 11-goal thrillers is going to be disappointed. Key point coming up. This is not always City's fault.

The opposition come to stifle us. It is a compliment. It means they are scared of us because we are good. It results in porr games mopst of the time. This does not mean we are shite, or that our players are shite, or that our manager is shite. It means the oppostion are scared and know that they need to be at their very, very best defensively to get anything other than a defeat. You might not like me saying this, but we are now in the position that liverpool were in thirty years ago or that united were in ten years ago. Poor matches are not totally City's fault. Sometimes the other team play well. This is the nature of sport. Think how many shit matches the crowds at the fleapit or Anfield have had to sit through becasue the opposition have no other ambition than to just stifle the home team. Did they moan like fuck about it? No they didn't. They backed their team like fans are supposed to do. They don't go around wanting to sack their manager simply because they've a had a couple of fucking goalless draws.

What fans need to do is understand this and still get behind the team. Despite all the high salaries and the money being spent and the lack of players that we can identify with, the role of the fan has changed in only one respect - we now need a bit more patience than we had before. Other than that our job is no different. We still need to go to the games and make some fucking noise. Make the place intimidating like it used to be on derby day when we were shit.

Right.

Anyone who goes to the game not prepared to sing themselves hoarse for the cause can fuck off to the Opera House.

Anyone who thinks we have got a divine right to play free-flowing football and win 12-0 every fucking week is a gibbering idiot who fails to grasp the reality of today's professional game.

Anyone who wants to sack the manager when the club is in its current position, a league place higher than we have finished for the last 33 years and joint top of our group in Europe, is a fucking cretin who has shown that they are thick enough to believe what they read in the media.

Best fans in the world? God's own club? Fucking bollocks. Sort your fucking selves out and start behaving like proper football fans instead of spoilt fucking babies.

Spot on. Although I would say a large percentage of fans at COMS never went to Maine Road. There a shit loads of day trippers, non fans etc. that simply dont get involved or support the team. On the other hand, on saturday, there was also many true blues signing against Mancini and booing him. Something which I do not agree with.

Maine Rd held about 34,000 and Eastlands about 48,000, so that sounds a pretty reasonable assumption.

Does that mean if you didn't go to Maine Rd you can't have an opinion? If that old guy who'd seen us play at Hyde Rd is still alive, he might tell us all to shut up.

You don't agree with people booing, which is fair enough. It's you're opinion and you're entitled to it. But why insult people who did boo by suggesting a lot of them are day trippers? I doubt the ones booing the ones who hadn't been to a game before - they'd have gone home a long time before that.

[CITYSTEVEDON]

The Past.

City are shite. if you work hard and keep it tight for twenty or thirty minutes, you can shut the crowd up and then pick them off once the crowd turn on their own. They have no players of any real talent. They are hard-working enough but ultimately a soft touch. Any game at City is potentially a piece of piss. Any team can go there and win.

Now.

City have got two or three players that might just get into a World XI. If you go there, you need to defend properly, preferably in numbers, and deny their creative players any space at all to work in. If they get space, they score. They don't make a lot of chances but the ones they do make they generally put away. In short they are a highly efficient outfit. This means that you MUST NOT make mistakes. If by chance you do make one, we need to have plenty of cover to hope to retrieve the situation. Therefore I want to see all of you focussing on defence. Counter attack quickly if you get the chance, but this is going to be hard as their defensive five don't get forward a great deal. A draw is probably the best we can get here, though the fickleness of their fans is starting to become an issue again as they may start to get on the backs of their players if the conditions are right. This may be our best chance but it is only possible if we keep their top players under control.

but chelsea, u@d,arsenal and liverpool have been playing teams who put 10 men behind the ball and still win. we need to do this now, we should be able to get behind teams who put 10 men behind the ball. ffs we have the team to do this

[brite blu sky]

I do get behind the team. What annoys me is when we play with zero ambition like we did against United. I'd been looking forward to that Derby for weeks and to go and see us play so negatively in such a big game was painful. We've seen sides with Fowler, Vassel, Macken and Mcmananan smash better United teams in the past.

Its true that every time we've hammered united we have had injuries / suspendsions and played patched up sides. We now have the quality players and are not beating United. Maybe something to do with hunger? Fear?

Teams with Mettomo and Macken in it just went for it. I want a Hinch or a Trev to score and really give the United fans some shit!

I really feel it was a bit of a one off that game, both teams not wanting to lose and no-one wanting to make a mistake. The rags put more effort in though, that was plain and annoying.
I did think right after the game that the return at the swamp will suit us better.

Sometimes in footie small unnoticed details like one extra day recovery can make a difference, not sure if that is the case for them looking like they had more energy but you never know.

I do think as i say they will be more than a bit worried at the return game. 4 pts off them would be ok.

It wasn't a one off, I sat through the exact same shit in the exact same tie last season. Last time we had 11 defenders on the pitch and one of them switched off towards the end. This time we held out. Terrified of the opposition, but we held out.

We did the same thing against Arsenal last season too.

We're going over it an over it, but the fact is that we HAVE to be more ambitious. The whole fucking footballing world can see it and if Mancini doesn't spot it soon, he WILL lose his job IMO.

Well i think it was a one off for reasons not just connected with City, the rags could have won it if they had gone for it more as they were showing more energy and better passing etc, but they didn't go for it either as they were just as worried about conceding the first goal if they did. Games like that happen sometimes even in Derbies. I fully admit it is frustrating as fucl to watch and you want someone to do something at all costs.

If i differ from others on here it is in not blaming Mancini for being cautious. I think he is cautious and there is a good argument to say he shouldn't be, but i dont think he is necessarily defensive minded and i think that will come out when he feels he can drop the cautiousness. Maybe that is wishful thinking Dub, i dont know, but i get the feeling that he is only being cautious because he doesn't have set up quite what he wants.
The fact that he could get away with it if he tried is another issue and i would agree that for some reason he seems not to want to divert from what his plan is. Although as i am pointing out and we have seen he is happier trying stuff out away from home!

( by the way last seasons games i am ignoring in judging him as i think there were too many other circumstances that just dont give us a true picture )

[Pretty Boy Lee]

like the players actually give a flying fuck about the fans.

unless they're buying the merch.

One of them bought a bunch of foster kids tickets and made personal dvd invites to each. I'd say he cares.

[Arjan Van Schotte]

like the players actually give a flying fuck about the fans.

unless they're buying the merch.

One of them bought a bunch of foster kids tickets and made personal dvd invites to each. I'd say he cares.

i'd say you're probably right. he cares about as much as i do when i drop £2 in a charity bucket. i'm yet to meet a socialist footballer.

who was that by the way? jurgen klinsman or ned?

[the_georgian_genius]

like the players actually give a flying fuck about the fans.

unless they're buying the merch.

One of them bought a bunch of foster kids tickets and made personal dvd invites to each. I'd say he cares.

i'd say you're probably right. he cares about as much as i do when i drop £2 in a charity bucket. i'm yet to meet a socialist footballer.

who was that by the way? jurgen klinsman or ned?

If i was a player playing for a football club i wouldn't give two shits about the fans.