Audi cup final

[Cocacolajojo1]

Sound points. How often do you see a treble winning side change their philosophy the following season? Players in and out is to be expected but a changing of tactics and positions is lunacy...

And at the same time, he has to change something because if he doesn't and they win something people will say it was all Heynckes' efforts. If he doesn't change anything and they don't win anything he'll get blamed for that.

I would say the same thing applies if he changes something though. It's the absurdity of the situation he's come into IMO, you just can't win in a situation like this. At least I don't think so. MInd you, Barcelona started a bit shaky in his first season, like the first game or two, and then they just took of.

We'll see I guess. But if he pulls this of, regardless of the quality of the squad he's inherited, he'll be one of the modern world's greatest football coaches. Just becausse of the circumstances. In my humble opinion.

[Ted Hughes]

Comparing the two so far, I much prefer the way the Count is operating than Guardiola. I thought it may be the case that Pellegrini would build something & hand it over to Pep in a few years, but I'm starting to believe he is actually building something better than Pep or Barca. More variation.

Meanwhile Pep signed Thiago to fix something which wasn't broken. I don't rate Martinez at all but the system, with him stood in the middle & others running around, worked. Thiago can't do that kind of job, he is too weak & isn't as good going forward as the other players they have for the attacking job.

[I Just Blue Myself]

Sound points. How often do you see a treble winning side change their philosophy the following season? Players in and out is to be expected but a changing of tactics and positions is lunacy...

And at the same time, he has to change something because if he doesn't and they win something people will say it was all Heynckes' efforts. If he doesn't change anything and they don't win anything he'll get blamed for that.

I would say the same thing applies if he changes something though. It's the absurdity of the situation he's come into IMO, you just can't win in a situation like this. At least I don't think so. MInd you, Barcelona started a bit shaky in his first season, like the first game or two, and then they just took of.

We'll see I guess. But if he pulls this of, regardless of the quality of the squad he's inherited, he'll be one of the modern world's greatest football coaches. Just becausse of the circumstances. In my humble opinion.

Obviously he has a certain philosophy & nobody expected him to just continue Heynckes' work. Pep said, that he'd just tweak nuances here & there in his first press conference, but now there seems to be genuine concern over his obsessive tinkering.

Honigstein picked up on most of the things I mentioned earlier & added some interesting bits (Pep's brother is apparently Thiago's agent).

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blo ... -guardiola

[brite blu sky]

I have said it before so it is no great revelation but I don't particularly rate Guardiola. That isn't to say he isn't competent, fanatical over detail etc or a decent man manager. The reason is simple in that the really hard work was done prior to him taking over at barca. He was also an insider very much respected as a person there. My take is that he added the extra 5% of motivation and oiling of the already existing machine. With the inside view he knew how to fine tune and get that extra. However the resulting team had only one way of playing, imo seriously lacked any wider sense of creativity. In fact what they had had prior to him he ironed out of them.

This argument is lost on most people I know, cos they can only see the winning and don't care to look or read deeper. I have run this past many many barca socios and surprisingly they all see the point and a lot agree completely.

Messi was the only wildcard in the pack and they showed how utterly devoid of ideas they were when he wasn't there or supplying the unusual.

So it now remains to be seen what he does with Bayern, even so he has a very very good team to start with, I'd like to see him actually build something up before I start lauding him as the messiah.

[MilnersJaw]

Jesus is quickly looking like one of our best signings in years. Although its only preseason he looks far better than any of the rag wingers.

[Ted Hughes]

I have said it before so it is no great revelation but I don't particularly rate Guardiola. That isn't to say he isn't competent, fanatical over detail etc or a decent man manager. The reason is simple in that the really hard work was done prior to him taking over at barca. He was also an insider very much respected as a person there. My take is that he added the extra 5% of motivation and oiling of the already existing machine. With the inside view he knew how to fine tune and get that extra. However the resulting team had only one way of playing, imo seriously lacked any wider sense of creativity. In fact what they had had prior to him he ironed out of them.

This argument is lost on most people I know, cos they can only see the winning and don't care to look or read deeper. I have run this past many many barca socios and surprisingly they all see the point and a lot agree completely.

Messi was the only wildcard in the pack and they showed how utterly devoid of ideas they were when he wasn't there or supplying the unusual.

So it now remains to be seen what he does with Bayern, even so he has a very very good team to start with, I'd like to see him actually build something up before I start lauding him as the messiah.

I don't know for sure, as he always had Messi & imo Mancini would have had a chance winning the Champs Lg with Messi in our team.

I do know that Txiki thinks he's a genius though. I also think Barca changed drastically under Pep, rather than just slightly. They also looked a much less effective team for me, after he left, in spite of their fantastic results domestically.

They seemed to squander more good situations & not recover the ball with the same intensity. Imo the shitness of Real Madrid last season was key to their success, as our shitness was key to Utd's.

Bayern is a very strange choice; a no win situation. I don't know if he will succeed there, but if he replaced Moyes at the rags, I would be very very concerned.

[brite blu sky]

It is the drastic change I did not see. By removing the less disciplined players that Rijkaard had and going 100% on getting the players to believe the tikka-takka, ( something they all grew up with anyway ), is basically most of what happened.

It worked so it is easy to laud it, imo as I have always said barca became impoverished in other ways.

They were a lot more fun under Rijkaard and much better to watch imo. Pep inspired the era of pretending to be robots.

but hey 10 robots are good at winning football matches.

[DoomMerchant]

I don't know for sure, as he always had Messi & imo Mancini would have had a chance winning the Champs Lg with Messi in our team.

I do know that Txiki thinks he's a genius though. I also think Barca changed drastically under Pep, rather than just slightly. They also looked a much less effective team for me, after he left, in spite of their fantastic results domestically.

They seemed to squander more good situations & not recover the ball with the same intensity. Imo the shitness of Real Madrid last season was key to their success, as our shitness was key to Utd's.

Bayern is a very strange choice; a no win situation. I don't know if he will succeed there, but if he replaced Moyes at the rags, I would be very very concerned.

winning the CL made Bayern a poisoned chalice for pep. He can only go backwards imho. And I hope he does.

[Ted Hughes]

It is the drastic change I did not see. By removing the less disciplined players that Rijkaard had and going 100% on getting the players to believe the tikka-takka, ( something they all grew up with anyway ), is basically most of what happened.

It worked so it is easy to laud it, imo as I have always said barca became impoverished in other ways.

They were a lot more fun under Rijkaard and much better to watch imo. Pep inspired the era of pretending to be robots.

but hey 10 robots are good at winning football matches.

With Ronaldinho, Eto etc, Barca were more similar to Real Madrid imo. They were also iffy when they lost the ball. The sudden 'legs' they found came under Pep imo. Whether that was down to Pep pills or not, we will probably find out one day,but if they continue to look much less energetic next season then it will be a clear indication that Pep was the reason they were so good at recovering the ball, whatever methods he used.

[Ted Hughes]

I don't know for sure, as he always had Messi & imo Mancini would have had a chance winning the Champs Lg with Messi in our team.

I do know that Txiki thinks he's a genius though. I also think Barca changed drastically under Pep, rather than just slightly. They also looked a much less effective team for me, after he left, in spite of their fantastic results domestically.

They seemed to squander more good situations & not recover the ball with the same intensity. Imo the shitness of Real Madrid last season was key to their success, as our shitness was key to Utd's.

Bayern is a very strange choice; a no win situation. I don't know if he will succeed there, but if he replaced Moyes at the rags, I would be very very concerned.

winning the CL made Bayern a poisoned chalice for pep. He can only go backwards imho. And I hope he does.

I just don't want him turning up over here & building an academy to rival ours.

[DoomMerchant]

I don't know for sure, as he always had Messi & imo Mancini would have had a chance winning the Champs Lg with Messi in our team.

I do know that Txiki thinks he's a genius though. I also think Barca changed drastically under Pep, rather than just slightly. They also looked a much less effective team for me, after he left, in spite of their fantastic results domestically.

They seemed to squander more good situations & not recover the ball with the same intensity. Imo the shitness of Real Madrid last season was key to their success, as our shitness was key to Utd's.

Bayern is a very strange choice; a no win situation. I don't know if he will succeed there, but if he replaced Moyes at the rags, I would be very very concerned.

winning the CL made Bayern a poisoned chalice for pep. He can only go backwards imho. And I hope he does.

I just don't want him turning up over here & building an academy to rival ours.

a couple of years at Bayern ought to have given us some legs to our academy i'd hope. ffs we've been "building" at something that wasn't completely broken from the start for 4 years now, haven't we?

[Ted Hughes]

I don't know for sure, as he always had Messi & imo Mancini would have had a chance winning the Champs Lg with Messi in our team.

I do know that Txiki thinks he's a genius though. I also think Barca changed drastically under Pep, rather than just slightly. They also looked a much less effective team for me, after he left, in spite of their fantastic results domestically.

They seemed to squander more good situations & not recover the ball with the same intensity. Imo the shitness of Real Madrid last season was key to their success, as our shitness was key to Utd's.

Bayern is a very strange choice; a no win situation. I don't know if he will succeed there, but if he replaced Moyes at the rags, I would be very very concerned.

winning the CL made Bayern a poisoned chalice for pep. He can only go backwards imho. And I hope he does.

I just don't want him turning up over here & building an academy to rival ours.

a couple of years at Bayern ought to have given us some legs to our academy i'd hope. ffs we've been "building" at something that wasn't completely broken from the start for 4 years now, haven't we?

I think it's only just starting to come together now. The original one was a championship standard set up mainly useful at generating money. Then I think it started functioning at junior level but the top people have possibly not been of the required standard & Mancini seemed to be uninterested.

Now we have better people involved but we are only just beginning to get a cohesive system involving the EDS & first team.

Guardiola moving into this country could poach players from us & halve our chances of getting the best kids in the future.