Women's World Cup Final

[BlueinBosnia]

Lots of talk about parity in pay for the women’s team. Should the men’s game offset the women’s team just so we can show equality or should we see them as separate entities, based on their respective revenues?

I’m no expert, but I think at international level we should get close to equal.Let’s face it it’s not coming away from the men, but out of the pockets of billionaires. International money isn’t a drop compared to club wages either.

Club wages are a different matter entirely and I think it would be nice to have a full time minimum but I couldn’t justify equal pay when there’s nothing equal about what the men get. Cole Palmer isn’t going to get what KdB gets is he?

surely it again comes down to the revenue that they generate?
in the weeks leading up to the competition, fifa were moaning that the european tv companies weren't coughing up big bucks to show the games
then there's ticket prices - can't imagine prices for the tournament just gone were even 50% of what fifa (rightly / wrongly) charged for the games in qatar
brands / sponsorship - i think that this is where the opportunity is for the women's game particularly in the wsl... they could stop piggy backing of the mens deal and find their own specific, hopefully more lucrative deals.
there's nothing sexist about my views on women's football... other than the city 1st team i have very little interest in the results of the other boys/youth/eds teams at city - i like to know that we have players coming through but if they win or lose i don't really care.... same goes for the england 1st team and then the u21/u20s etc...

The cheapest tickets for Qatar were 11 USD (residents), and for the women's they were 9.80 USD (obstructed view), but generally, on a like-for-like comparison, they were slightly less than half the price, like you said. In terms of attendance, it seems about 70-72% of the amount of tickets were sold for Australia/NZ as for Qatar, so you're talking about 30-ish percent of the revenue from ticket sales. However, a lot of people going to games in the women's WC would be kids, so revenue generated from fan zones is probably much, much lower (because kids don't drink, and people tend to consume less alcohol when at a game with their families). I just checked up, and the beer sponsor for the WWC was only announced in June (wrapped up with the WC26 deal), so it probably wasn't a high priority for FIFA or potential sponsors.

For club-level sponsorship, I don't think that's practical: How would it work in reality when it comes to kit deals and exclusivity rights? Would a women's team be allowed to sign a kit deal with Umbro if the men's team was with Adidas? And, if so, what would there be to stop youth teams doing the same? We're now in a position with the women's game that a club like City can just throw a few hundred grand at a women's team for 'visibility' purposes; a figure that no unaffiliated women's club would ever be able to match. To compound that, current FFP rules allow women's teams to use the income of their parent club when considering salary caps/turnover. If they were considered standalone entities, it would give unaffiliated clubs more relative financial clout, but players' earnings would almost certainly fall dramatically (which again is generally never mentioned by journalists talking about pay parity). For better or worse, the women's game is too heavily tied to the men's from a financial perspective to be able to extricate itself without the current (and probably next generation(s) of) players losing out.

[Indianablue]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

[Mase]

With the pay thing, both men and women shouldn’t be paid for playing for their country. But as far as I was aware the men donate theirs to charity?

[Nigels Tackle]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

[Outcast]

I wonder of the reaction if Wren Kitchens decided to sponsor them?

Male footballers get shit load of abuse on and off the field. If they want parity, careful what you wish for, they won't be attracting all happy clappers.

It's a waste of time comparing, they'll never reach those heights but they can certainly improve gradually, it will take time to grow, technical ability and financially

[BlueinBosnia]

With the pay thing, both men and women shouldn’t be paid for playing for their country. But as far as I was aware the men donate theirs to charity?

They get an appearance fee, which is £2000 per game it seems. I think this is relatively recent (it started in the mid-late 90s from what I remember, and was about £800 back then). There's also a win bonus from the FA (which is different to prize money from FIFA/UEFA). However, I'd assume they get extra money from personal and FA sponsors on top of this.

[Mase]

With the pay thing, both men and women shouldn’t be paid for playing for their country. But as far as I was aware the men donate theirs to charity?

They get an appearance fee, which is £2000 per game it seems. I think this is relatively recent (it started in the mid-late 90s from what I remember, and was about £800 back then). There's also a win bonus from the FA (which is different to prize money from FIFA/UEFA). However, I'd assume they get extra money from personal and FA sponsors on top of this.

That makes sense. I was sure they didn’t get paid back in the day.

[BlueinBosnia]

With the pay thing, both men and women shouldn’t be paid for playing for their country. But as far as I was aware the men donate theirs to charity?

They get an appearance fee, which is £2000 per game it seems. I think this is relatively recent (it started in the mid-late 90s from what I remember, and was about £800 back then). There's also a win bonus from the FA (which is different to prize money from FIFA/UEFA). However, I'd assume they get extra money from personal and FA sponsors on top of this.

That makes sense. I was sure they didn’t get paid back in the day.

There was a big kerfuffle about it when Giggs was at his peak, which is why I think it was around that time.

[Indianablue]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

My daughter plays netball in an Exeter league, they had a netball semi final party, she loved being in Cardiff on Rugby international weekend and she watched the CL final with me. A sporty woman no doubt but she didn't really get up for the football .

[Nigels Tackle]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

My daughter plays netball in an Exeter league, they had a netball semi final party, she loved being in Cardiff on Rugby international weekend and she watched the CL final with me. A sporty woman no doubt but she didn't really get up for the football .

i think that the everyone associated with women's football thinks that other women love football as much as they do... the progress they've made is amazing but it does seem to be coming with a potential negative impact (on funding) for the other, more traditionally female, sports such as netball, hockey etc..

[Mase]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

My daughter plays netball in an Exeter league, they had a netball semi final party, she loved being in Cardiff on Rugby international weekend and she watched the CL final with me. A sporty woman no doubt but she didn't really get up for the football .

i think that the everyone associated with women's football thinks that other women love football as much as they do... the progress they've made is amazing but it does seem to be coming with a potential negative impact (on funding) for the other, more traditionally female, sports such as netball, hockey etc..

Is the progress they’ve made based on the piggybacking of the men’s game? They’ve hardly started from a standing start have they? Should they be looking at the men’s game and being appreciative, rather than pushing the equal pay narrative? If it wasn’t for the men’s game they’d probably consider themselves paid well.

Genuine question

[BlueinBosnia]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

My daughter plays netball in an Exeter league, they had a netball semi final party, she loved being in Cardiff on Rugby international weekend and she watched the CL final with me. A sporty woman no doubt but she didn't really get up for the football .

i think that the everyone associated with women's football thinks that other women love football as much as they do... the progress they've made is amazing but it does seem to be coming with a potential negative impact (on funding) for the other, more traditionally female, sports such as netball, hockey etc..

That's a fair point. It would be good to see pay comparisons for those sports. I used to work with 2 male hockey players who played at the top level (alongside professionals/internationals), and at the time (over 15 years ago) male pros were paid around £18K per year, and earned almost the same as that in sponsorship, media appearances, etc. I think there was an odd situation, though, where pros were all paid the same amount, and some people preferred to remain amateur, because they earned more in their full-time job.

(Interesting side story to this: One of my colleagues was off to training with his full kit, and a probably-new policeman stopped him for carrying a hockey stick (inside a bag, but it was an obvious hockey bag, or the head was poking out), to check whether he had a ball. Despite him having pads, shoes, kit, tracksuit, water bottle, and everything else, he just-so-happened to not be carrying a ball, so the policeman took him in and tried to caution him on a technicality. When he arrived at the station, the other police apparently just laughed at the young cop for being a busybody).

Edit: just checked, and in 2018 pay parity in hockey was 52:48 in favour of women according to one article. I wonder if it's similar these days?

[Plain Speaking]

I thought the Spain women played the better football and deserved to win, I only watched the final but thought the standard was significantly higher than domestic women's football games, (like City women), I have seen. City men are much better than England men.

Unfortunately the high pitch commentary from Vicki Sparks is horrible and makes me want to switch it off every time I hear her.

[Indianablue]

Too many mistakes being made by players and overhyped to fuck. I'd much rather watch women play a sport they were actually good at. Tennis, Golf, athletics, swimming , gymnastics , netball. All are worthy of watching as although they couldn't physically compete with males, they don't make mistakes. In a few years time the standards will improve but they only deserve pay increases on merit and it needs to be self supporting. The commentary was crap and completely biased.
As an event i much preferred watching the netball World cup

if i was a feminist, i'd be more outraged (they always are) that the england women's netball team weren't afforded the same media coverage for reaching the netball world cup final as the women's football team were.

My daughter plays netball in an Exeter league, they had a netball semi final party, she loved being in Cardiff on Rugby international weekend and she watched the CL final with me. A sporty woman no doubt but she didn't really get up for the football .

i think that the everyone associated with women's football thinks that other women love football as much as they do... the progress they've made is amazing but it does seem to be coming with a potential negative impact (on funding) for the other, more traditionally female, sports such as netball, hockey etc..

That's a fair point. It would be good to see pay comparisons for those sports. I used to work with 2 male hockey players who played at the top level (alongside professionals/internationals), and at the time (over 15 years ago) male pros were paid around £18K per year, and earned almost the same as that in sponsorship, media appearances, etc. I think there was an odd situation, though, where pros were all paid the same amount, and some people preferred to remain amateur, because they earned more in their full-time job.

(Interesting side story to this: One of my colleagues was off to training with his full kit, and a probably-new policeman stopped him for carrying a hockey stick (inside a bag, but it was an obvious hockey bag, or the head was poking out), to check whether he had a ball. Despite him having pads, shoes, kit, tracksuit, water bottle, and everything else, he just-so-happened to not be carrying a ball, so the policeman took him in and tried to caution him on a technicality. When he arrived at the station, the other police apparently just laughed at the young cop for being a busybody).

Edit: just checked, and in 2018 pay parity in hockey was 52:48 in favour of women according to one article. I wonder if it's similar these days?

In the 80s, a guy used to work for me , young lad , West Indian descent. A good cricketer, held overnight after a stop and search in Hackney. Charged with possession of a dangerous weapon. He had half a cricket ball fixed to a stick he used to use it to bed in his cricket bats. Following a delegation of a few others at work visiting the police station, he was finally released without charge