Ball Playing Keeper

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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Cocacolajojo » Mon May 08, 2017 9:15 am

Hazy2 wrote:
zuricity wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:Nuer learned to pass the ball under Pep. City will not change and if you want to win the CL you need the ball. Look st last weeks S/F two high press teams cut open by calm passing teams that cut through lines starting at the back with keepers that are great on the ball even if it is to slow it down, Bravo was a top keeper at Barca, not sure he will recover, City will pass out of the back get used to it.


No he didn't !

Neuer has been passing the ball out from the back since he was a kid. that is what goalies outside of the PL are trained to do. Even I had my Junior Teams playing from the back. Most certainly it is not a Pep idea. This is nothing new at all. Keeping Possession is not a Pep concept.


It's not possession its distribution mate ! Nuer boomed it 100 yards 9/10 straight down the pitch, Quality knock tbh. Pep, has not invented anything new what he has done is added variety to Bayern, Alaba now world Class he links Fullbacks and Keepers. Working the forwards for the opposition Lham, got a new lease under Pep. Juve now have Buffon linked to Danny Alves, as the massive area you have to stop or they get out from the back and at you in a flash, see last weeks Goal. Bonnuci and Chellini sitting in with cigars on. Monaco pressed Juve like they did us, lost the battle to a drilled team. City have had average footballers at the back when on the ball when pressed they are 4 touch merchants, Space gone no pass and ball given away which teams know, Arsenal should have been taken apart, we wasted the ball so many times it must have had Pep frustrated as we have great attackers with average service when it matters. Pep and Bravo are not used to that, Defenders under pressure to create space in there world is easy, For us it is panic from players and fans. Vinny, has brought a calmness that's great to see but only a temporary solution, All the Fullbacks will all be gone as we need the step up in quality and a natural outlet from keeper to wide areas 100 times faster, when we get that ! the keeper and the Centre-halfs will have the pressure released as the attackers and Midfielders are closing down wide areas. Barca scored a winner at Madrid which we have all seen a thousand times Keeper takes a risk Gives it the full back at 2-2 last minute BTW, he travels, into a space breaks the lines game is stretched he creates chaos and a winning Goal. Pep instilled that in the DNA at Barca even last minute it's on if you have the players. Back to Juve, could not and would do that until Alves arrived from Barca, now they are a threat to anyone from Buffon to a goal.


Neuer was coveted for his ball playing skills before pep. sorry mate.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 11:22 am

Cocacolajojo wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:
zuricity wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:Nuer learned to pass the ball under Pep. City will not change and if you want to win the CL you need the ball. Look st last weeks S/F two high press teams cut open by calm passing teams that cut through lines starting at the back with keepers that are great on the ball even if it is to slow it down, Bravo was a top keeper at Barca, not sure he will recover, City will pass out of the back get used to it.


No he didn't !

Neuer has been passing the ball out from the back since he was a kid. that is what goalies outside of the PL are trained to do. Even I had my Junior Teams playing from the back. Most certainly it is not a Pep idea. This is nothing new at all. Keeping Possession is not a Pep concept.


It's not possession its distribution mate ! Nuer boomed it 100 yards 9/10 straight down the pitch, Quality knock tbh. Pep, has not invented anything new what he has done is added variety to Bayern, Alaba now world Class he links Fullbacks and Keepers. Working the forwards for the opposition Lham, got a new lease under Pep. Juve now have Buffon linked to Danny Alves, as the massive area you have to stop or they get out from the back and at you in a flash, see last weeks Goal. Bonnuci and Chellini sitting in with cigars on. Monaco pressed Juve like they did us, lost the battle to a drilled team. City have had average footballers at the back when on the ball when pressed they are 4 touch merchants, Space gone no pass and ball given away which teams know, Arsenal should have been taken apart, we wasted the ball so many times it must have had Pep frustrated as we have great attackers with average service when it matters. Pep and Bravo are not used to that, Defenders under pressure to create space in there world is easy, For us it is panic from players and fans. Vinny, has brought a calmness that's great to see but only a temporary solution, All the Fullbacks will all be gone as we need the step up in quality and a natural outlet from keeper to wide areas 100 times faster, when we get that ! the keeper and the Centre-halfs will have the pressure released as the attackers and Midfielders are closing down wide areas. Barca scored a winner at Madrid which we have all seen a thousand times Keeper takes a risk Gives it the full back at 2-2 last minute BTW, he travels, into a space breaks the lines game is stretched he creates chaos and a winning Goal. Pep instilled that in the DNA at Barca even last minute it's on if you have the players. Back to Juve, could not and would do that until Alves arrived from Barca, now they are a threat to anyone from Buffon to a goal.


Neuer was coveted for his ball playing skills before pep. sorry mate.


not denying that he was like a quarter back. De Gea the same strike of a ball like Hoddle in his pomp.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby iwasthere2012 » Mon May 08, 2017 11:28 am

Hazy2 wrote:De Gea the same strike of a ball like Hoddle in his pomp.


The last few Rag matches, I've been unfortunate enough to endure, I didn't think much of De Gea's distribution.
He's a smashing keeper but looked far from comfortable having to kick under pressure.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 11:42 am

iwasthere2012 wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:De Gea the same strike of a ball like Hoddle in his pomp.


The last few Rag matches, I've been unfortunate enough to endure, I didn't think much of De Gea's distribution.
He's a smashing keeper but looked far from comfortable having to kick under pressure.


Bad back with all the packing he has been doing !!!
From pro scouting on top keepers..
Back to Nuer His decision making also has outstanding effects in the passing game.

Structuring agent, playmaker, and zone finder

Neuer’s immense contribution in the passing game is not only because he is a passing option in the deep build-up play but he also participates in the creation of the long-term course of attack. For example, Neuer likes to distribute diagonal long balls across the pitch into areas the opponent leaves open and they usually arrive accurately. If the opponent leaves certain spaces on the pitch wide open, as a Bayern fan, you can be sure that the attack will either be initiated by a direct long ball or an intelligent targeting of these spaces via short passes towards the open zones – thanks to Neuer.

Neuer’s intelligence with respect to long balls is most noticeable under pressure. Often, he clears the ball seemingly messy and far up the pitch but these balls either go to open players or – probably even more often – simply into spaces where there are relatively many Bayern players nearby in principle. Dangerous counterattacks by the opponent after such balls rarely occur. Most of the time, Bayern can immediately organize defensively with more or less stable forward pressing and even successfully chase directly after the second ball.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby zuricity » Mon May 08, 2017 11:58 am

Make up your mind Hazy2 are you talking about Passing or Distribution :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 1:32 pm

zuricity wrote:Make up your mind Hazy2 are you talking about Passing or Distribution :roll: :roll: :roll:


Nuer adapted, City have to recruit and adapt, fans have to chill. its both in answer to your question as our second pass is so slow due to old players new tricks ;) , On Saturday Jesus pressed and Palace panicked, just as we do against the better teams, for Pep that is an easy fix with the right players.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Socrates » Mon May 08, 2017 2:43 pm

If we can't find a keeper who can both sweep and save then we need one of each and play them match by match. One who plays sweeper keeper for the Champions League and selected Premier League games, the other for the majority of Premier League games and the domestic cups.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Mikhail Chigorin » Mon May 08, 2017 3:22 pm

Socrates wrote:If we can't find a keeper who can both sweep and save then we need one of each and play them match by match. One who plays sweeper keeper for the Champions League and selected Premier League games, the other for the majority of Premier League games and the domestic cups.


A nice bit of thinking outside the (six yard ??) box, Socs. :roll:
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 3:40 pm

Mikhail Chigorin wrote:
Socrates wrote:If we can't find a keeper who can both sweep and save then we need one of each and play them match by match. One who plays sweeper keeper for the Champions League and selected Premier League games, the other for the majority of Premier League games and the domestic cups.


A nice bit of thinking outside the (six yard ??) box, Socs. :roll:


Barca rotated the keepers same ethos. Get it and give it as fast as you can.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby zuricity » Mon May 08, 2017 6:23 pm

I've seen Neuer Welly the ball into touch on many occasions, but keep digging Hazy2.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 6:30 pm

zuricity wrote:I've seen Neuer Welly the ball into touch on many occasions, but keep digging Hazy2.



It's football chat keep smiling mate. You will get it 1 day.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby zuricity » Mon May 08, 2017 6:43 pm

Hazy2 wrote:
zuricity wrote:I've seen Neuer Welly the ball into touch on many occasions, but keep digging Hazy2.



It's football chat keep smiling mate. You will get it 1 day.


he he !
Fact is , Bravo is crap with a capital C . The midfield engine should be dictating how the ball gets played around not the goalie or as in our case woeful and old full backs.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Hazy2 » Mon May 08, 2017 7:19 pm

zuricity wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:
zuricity wrote:I've seen Neuer Welly the ball into touch on many occasions, but keep digging Hazy2.



It's football chat keep smiling mate. You will get it 1 day.


he he !
Fact is , Bravo is crap with a capital C . The midfield engine should be dictating how the ball gets played around not the goalie or as in our case woeful and old full backs.


Juve scrapped 3 centre backs Buffon to Alves, team gooooooaaaaaalllllll of the season mate, even the old lady changed.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Plain Speaking » Mon May 08, 2017 8:15 pm

Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Dimples » Mon May 08, 2017 8:18 pm

Plain Speaking wrote:
Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.


Goalkeeping was not the only reason Hart was sold.
Pep was breaking up a cartel and making a statement.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Niall Quinns Discopants » Mon May 08, 2017 9:45 pm

Dimples wrote:
Plain Speaking wrote:
Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.


Goalkeeping was not the only reason Hart was sold.
Pep was breaking up a cartel and making a statement.


What cartel?

Also Joe Hart is one of the best keepers to ever play in Premier League. Something to consider.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby Wonderwall » Mon May 08, 2017 10:02 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:
Dimples wrote:
Plain Speaking wrote:
Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.


Goalkeeping was not the only reason Hart was sold.
Pep was breaking up a cartel and making a statement.


What cartel?

Also Joe Hart is one of the best keepers to ever play in Premier League. Something to consider.


That's a very good point. Guardiola has probably knock 10m off Harts price tag with his dismissive attitude to hart. He is England's no1 but now clubs are hesitant because of the guardiola effect.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby aaron bond » Tue May 09, 2017 3:12 am

The treatment of Hart was just an all-round bad decision.

Considering the amount of effort Pep has put into trying to convert Kolarov into a centre back or Navas/Fernandinho into full backs, it really has been stupid of him not to give Hart a chance.

Furthermore, by making it clear publicly that he does not like Hart, we will now sell a goalkeeper who should command a significant transfer fee for a low value or send him out on loan again with us subsidising his wages.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby patrickblue » Tue May 09, 2017 2:36 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:
Dimples wrote:
Plain Speaking wrote:
Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.


Goalkeeping was not the only reason Hart was sold.
Pep was breaking up a cartel and making a statement.


What cartel?



The one that got rid of Mancini.

Not that I necessarily think that was one, or the only reason for Pep dumping him, but it sure as hell wasn't just because Hart can't play with the ball at his feet, as the media would have us believe.
There was something else going on there, big time, and Pep was making a point, something that has spectacularly backfired on him.
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Re: Ball Playing Keeper

Postby sheblue » Tue May 09, 2017 2:55 pm

Dimples wrote:
Plain Speaking wrote:
Dubciteh wrote:How about we sign a ball playing keeper thats also a great actual keeper.....seems a no brainer to me, willy, joe or bravo arent that person.

If pep had got Ter Stegan like he wanted this season would have been oh so different.

I'm not so sure about Ter Stegen. When we played Barca Ter Stegen had a nightmare. Bravo played much better than him right up to the moment of madness that Bravo got himself sent off.
No other league has the physicality of the PL.

Pep got rid of Hart without​ giving him a chance. IMO he underestimated his ability.
Personally I think Pep needs to show more flexibility. I believe Hart could have improved his distribution and we would have challenged for the title and maybe even the CL if we had kept Hart.

If Hart is sold to a PL rival I think we will regret it.


Goalkeeping was not the only reason Hart was sold.
Pep was breaking up a cartel and making a statement.


I have always felt that there was way more to it than not being good with his feet. He was good with his mouth though and therein lies the problem.
He was moved on pretty sharpish after all.
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