The mancityfans.net football forum

Couldn't spot a thread to put this in, so apologies if there is somewhere. If the bottom line for UEFA is 'increasing revenues', then this could turn out to be a real blow to genuine competition.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/201 ... -december/

The Champions League is to undergo what could be a major revamp after Uefa confirmed it would decide in December on proposed changes to its elite club competition.

The director of competitions for European football’s governing body revealed a format for the 2018-21 seasons of the Champions League would be determined “by the end of the year”.

Giorgio Marchetti’s pronouncement followed behind-closed-doors meetings involving senior club officials ahead of Saturday’s final between Real Madrid and Atletico Madrid.

Amendments on the table range from tweaks to the Champions League’s entry criteria to the introduction of a fully-fledged European Super League, although more likely is an overhaul of a group stage many believe has become stale and is holding back Uefa’s ability to generate revenue.

“We need a format by the end of the year,” said Marchetti. “We are consulting and we are listening.”

Specific options include more guaranteed entries for the strongest leagues, protected places for the biggest clubs, and playing matches on Saturdays rather than midweek to appeal to Asian and American audiences.

Some of the biggest European teams are also worried about the growing financial chasm between themselves and sides from Premier League, where the bottom club will earn £100m from next season, far in excess of the winner of the Champions League.

Juventus president Andrea Agnelli has noted even the 32-franchise NFL gets much more TV revenue than the Champions League, despite a smaller core fan base and little broad appeal outside the United States.

Manchester United, Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea and Manchester City held a secret meeting earlier this year at which the prospect of a European Super League was raised.

That would be resisted by the Premier League, which would also fight any attempt to play Champions League matches on a Saturday where its own competition is taking place.

the fact that they've referenced the nfl as a model means that 'smaller' clubs might as well just give up now. rip football.

why tf were those minnows from scouseland involved in meetings with the PL big 4?

I can imagine them introducing a rule that if you've won the European Cup 3 or more times, you get guaranteed permanent entry, just so long as you remain in the top flight of your domestic league.

That'd keep Rags, Inter, Milan and Liverpool safe, while also guaranteeing a place for Ajax, one of the teams intent on starting some kind of breakaway league.

.........Specific options include more guaranteed entries for the strongest leagues, protected places for the biggest clubs, and playing matches on Saturdays rather than midweek to appeal to Asian and American audiences......

No need to say anymore - they want to get Liverpool and MU back in - by Hook or by Crook

zuricity wrote:why tf were those minnows from scouseland involved in meetings with the PL big 4?

Us and the Chavs were the interlopers (hopefully just keeping an eyes on what these cunts are up to). Rags dippers and gooners have always acted in a concerted way to stitch up everyone else.

BlueinBosnia wrote:I can imagine them introducing a rule that if you've won the European Cup 3 or more times, you get guaranteed permanent entry, just so long as you remain in the top flight of your domestic league.

That'd keep Rags, Inter, Milan and Liverpool safe, while also guaranteeing a place for Ajax, one of the teams intent on starting some kind of breakaway league.

Sadly, you are probably bang on the money.

nottsblue wrote:

BlueinBosnia wrote:I can imagine them introducing a rule that if you've won the European Cup 3 or more times, you get guaranteed permanent entry, just so long as you remain in the top flight of your domestic league.

That'd keep Rags, Inter, Milan and Liverpool safe, while also guaranteeing a place for Ajax, one of the teams intent on starting some kind of breakaway league.

Sadly, you are probably bang on the money.

Whilst it is an interesting thought about the Rags etc.

Don't you think other teams in the PL would protest about the guaranteed unfair competition in Europe ?

I've always thought that people's attitude to football is mainly influenced by the team they follow, but I'm beginning to think otherwise.
Now we're part of it, it's still as disgusting as ever, and it appears that most on here agree.
Rags and dippers meanwhile, still seem to think it's a good move, and to quote a shitty advertising slogan, they think "they're worth it"

If this happens it might just push me to stop watching football.

zuricity wrote:

nottsblue wrote:

BlueinBosnia wrote:I can imagine them introducing a rule that if you've won the European Cup 3 or more times, you get guaranteed permanent entry, just so long as you remain in the top flight of your domestic league.

That'd keep Rags, Inter, Milan and Liverpool safe, while also guaranteeing a place for Ajax, one of the teams intent on starting some kind of breakaway league.

Sadly, you are probably bang on the money.

Whilst it is an interesting thought about the Rags etc.

Don't you think other teams in the PL would protest about the guaranteed unfair competition in Europe ?

They don't have a say. It really is as simple as that. They arent called the Sky4 for nothing. Even spuds who have flirted for a few years now probably get given the odd scrap. We have won the PL twice to force our way in and that is being received in the most begrudging manner, FFP being their ploy to try and stop us

zuricity wrote:

nottsblue wrote:

BlueinBosnia wrote:I can imagine them introducing a rule that if you've won the European Cup 3 or more times, you get guaranteed permanent entry, just so long as you remain in the top flight of your domestic league.

That'd keep Rags, Inter, Milan and Liverpool safe, while also guaranteeing a place for Ajax, one of the teams intent on starting some kind of breakaway league.

Sadly, you are probably bang on the money.

Whilst it is an interesting thought about the Rags etc.

Don't you think other teams in the PL would protest about the guaranteed unfair competition in Europe ?

I'd have thought it would be as additional places, either straight into the group or into the non-league-winners' Play-Off Round (which would then be revamped to ensure at least some of them get automatic seeding).

Say the league finished as it did this season, England would get 6 places - 3 in the Group Stage, plus 3 in the Play-Offs. I think there'd be uproar from some pretty influential clubs if these 'Super Club status' places were at the expense of higher league finishers.

UEFA would be able to argue that there's no discrimination using this criteria - all clubs have a chance at gaining Super Club status. Even Notts Forest are just one CL win away...

This favouring of the certain clubs makes my blood boil.
In a way I hope some cunts go on and form their entirety own breakawayleague independent of all local FA's. Then the rest could continue to compete in their own leagues without them

gillie wrote:If this happens it might just push me to stop watching football.

With you on that one.

Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

Im_Spartacus wrote:Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

It would be more honest,at least.

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

It would be more honest,at least.

The only way I could ever support something like that, is if there was a mechanism by which a big club could lose their place if they stank their league out for 2/3 years in a row, a fair coefficient system that was based solely on domestic performance so that a club isn't tempted to pick and choose which seasons they bother competing in their domestic competitions (as per our current cups). This type of mechanism would almost certainly be needed to maintain the integrity of domestic leagues. (eg, we would probably have fucked the league off and just finished 5th this year in pursuit of CL if guaranteed a place)

Im_Spartacus wrote:

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

It would be more honest,at least.

The only way I could ever support something like that, is if there was a mechanism by which a big club could lose their place if they stank their league out for 2/3 years in a row, a fair coefficient system that was based solely on domestic performance so that a club isn't tempted to pick and choose which seasons they bother competing in their domestic competitions (as per our current cups). This type of mechanism would almost certainly be needed to maintain the integrity of domestic leagues. (eg, we would probably have fucked the league off and just finished 5th this year in pursuit of CL if guaranteed a place)

To be honest, ever since they started calling football a product, I have struggled with my enthusiasm for the professional game. It is a business and so far removed from what I played and loved and have watched my son playing. I think the reason so many of us still love watching the underage teams is that they are the last vestiges of the virtues of the game that we love. We cling to the wholesomeness shown before agents and greed and business corrupts the purity of the sport out of them.
City are still rallying against the machine and as such I still can get enthusiastic about us winning against the odds being manipulated by the establishment.

I'm with Gillie on this one though. If we just become part of a closed shop designed to keep the money coming in then no thanks.
We become less and less a sports fan and more and more a customer or consumer.

There is no other industry on earth that could demand the same unconditional customer support that football does. If we are treated first and foremost as consumers then I predict a future where globally you will see the same customer/consumer fickleness when it comes to brand loyalty.

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

It would be more honest,at least.

The only way I could ever support something like that, is if there was a mechanism by which a big club could lose their place if they stank their league out for 2/3 years in a row, a fair coefficient system that was based solely on domestic performance so that a club isn't tempted to pick and choose which seasons they bother competing in their domestic competitions (as per our current cups). This type of mechanism would almost certainly be needed to maintain the integrity of domestic leagues. (eg, we would probably have fucked the league off and just finished 5th this year in pursuit of CL if guaranteed a place)

To be honest, ever since they started calling football a product, I have struggled with my enthusiasm for the professional game. It is a business and so far removed from what I played and loved and have watched my son playing. I think the reason so many of us still love watching the underage teams is that they are the last vestiges of the virtues of the game that we love. We cling to the wholesomeness shown before agents and greed and business corrupts the purity of the sport out of them.
City are still rallying against the machine and as such I still can get enthusiastic about us winning against the odds being manipulated by the establishment.

I'm with Gillie on this one though. If we just become part of a closed shop designed to keep the money coming in then no thanks.
We become less and less a sports fan and more and more a customer or consumer.

There is no other industry on earth that could demand the same unconditional customer support that football does. If we are treated first and foremost as consumers then I predict a future where globally you will see the same customer/consumer fickleness when it comes to brand loyalty.

'franchise'
***shiver***

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:

iwasthere2012 wrote:

Im_Spartacus wrote:Amongst the proposals are 'Protected places for bigger clubs' - yet people, usually United, Liverpool and Arsenal fans are still blinkered to what Financial Fair Play was actually all about.

If protected places comes in, they really should just abandon the charade that there is a free competition, and go with a closed super league

It would be more honest,at least.

The only way I could ever support something like that, is if there was a mechanism by which a big club could lose their place if they stank their league out for 2/3 years in a row, a fair coefficient system that was based solely on domestic performance so that a club isn't tempted to pick and choose which seasons they bother competing in their domestic competitions (as per our current cups). This type of mechanism would almost certainly be needed to maintain the integrity of domestic leagues. (eg, we would probably have fucked the league off and just finished 5th this year in pursuit of CL if guaranteed a place)

To be honest, ever since they started calling football a product, I have struggled with my enthusiasm for the professional game. It is a business and so far removed from what I played and loved and have watched my son playing. I think the reason so many of us still love watching the underage teams is that they are the last vestiges of the virtues of the game that we love. We cling to the wholesomeness shown before agents and greed and business corrupts the purity of the sport out of them.
City are still rallying against the machine and as such I still can get enthusiastic about us winning against the odds being manipulated by the establishment.

I'm with Gillie on this one though. If we just become part of a closed shop designed to keep the money coming in then no thanks.
We become less and less a sports fan and more and more a customer or consumer.

There is no other industry on earth that could demand the same unconditional customer support that football does. If we are treated first and foremost as consumers then I predict a future where globally you will see the same customer/consumer fickleness when it comes to brand loyalty.

I agree with every word. For many years now I have acted like a consumer in response to the way the game treats me - sometimes my cold, black and white factual views might fuck some off on here, but the truth is, I haven't unconditionally loved watching City since I was about 25, I've grown up, moved on and found other priorities in life. So now if I'm paying for a product or an experience (seeing as that's how it's marketed), they need to deliver, and its clear that more and more football fans are taking that stance even on this board. The diehards look on us with scorn, but more fool them - it's them with the addiction, it's them that football is bleeding dry and Manchester City that are part of that, and until they are either bled dry or take a stand by cancelling season cards and pay tv subscriptions, nothing will change.

It's clear however that something IS changing, there is something happening, as the CL changes are in response to declining advertising revenues.

I prepaid in the cup scheme the first year of the CL, then never paid to attend a home game since (did a hospitality visit for Dortmund), and don't think I would ever pay for a Champions League home game, because it's a horrible fucking staged event. I've been to a few away games, but mainly for social reasons to meet up with my mates since I moved to the middle east.

I absolutely fucking detest what European football represents.