EDS v Utd on TV tonight

[iwasthere2012]

Oh dear we look a pile of shite

That's a bit harsh.
They are a bit sharper all over the park.
We've not really created anything of note in the last third.
Forwards are not involved.

[dick dastardley]

Oh dear we look a pile of shite

That's a bit harsh.
They are a bit sharper all over the park.
We've not really created anything of note in the last third.
Forwards are not involved.

Yeah ur right but created nothing and sloppy passes don't help

[iwasthere2012]

Not a great half really. Wonderwall you see more of them than most. I saw similarities with the first team there. Give away a goal of our own making, although it was well taken.The front men are very isolated when they get on the ball. Barker hasn't got going, but he doesn't have a lot of options when he gets it.
United are looking sharper and more purposeful.
The moving of the ball seems a little slow. I was expecting more.

[dick dastardley]

Our build up play is sooo slow

[Wonderwall]

Not a great half really. Wonderwall you see more of them than most. I saw similarities with the first team there. Give away a goal of our own making, although it was well taken.The front men are very isolated when they get on the ball. Barker hasn't got going, but he doesn't have a lot of options when he gets it.
United are looking sharper and more purposeful.
The moving of the ball seems a little slow. I was expecting more.

Extremely pissed off. As I am unable to watch it. I have had other unexpected last minute commitments. Jumping on here and twitter for updates.

Tbh when I saw the line ups I expected a city win.

[dick dastardley]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

[iwasthere2012]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

To add to that WW. I thought overall we were as lethargic as the first team. Particularly first half. Barker was isolated but was just strolling when he lost the ball.
Huge gap in the centre of the park first half.
United got onto the man on the ball very quickly.
Their goal was a result of a very disorganized defense. They could have scored earlier but for Gunn. Keane straight through after mix up in the midfield.
We created nothing first half.
Second half was one way traffic with City the only ones playing football, but there again we got nowhere near their goal until the last ten minutes, as we pushed them further and further back.
Barker.....very disappointing.
Celina.....non existant.
Bytyqi.....didn't look up to it.
A. Garcia tried, particularly late on, but overall too slow and predictable. You can see potential though.
Humphreys did ok when he came on.
Glendon looks comfortable, but didn't produce much.
Altogether, too easy for United, who obviously have license from their management, to put ten men behind the ball all game. They are not averse to just booting it anywhere upfield, which they increasingly did as the second half wore on.
Like the first team, we had lots of possession and passed around across the park but didn't penetrate the last third.

On a positive, I still like the look of Angelino and Adarbioyo and maybe Garcia.
Nobody else stood out.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

To add to that WW. I thought overall we were as lethargic as the first team. Particularly first half. Barker was isolated but was just strolling when he lost the ball.
Huge gap in the centre of the park first half.
United got onto the man on the ball very quickly.
Their goal was a result of a very disorganized defense. They could have scored earlier but for Gunn. Keane straight through after mix up in the midfield.
We created nothing first half.
Second half was one way traffic with City the only ones playing football, but there again we got nowhere near their goal until the last ten minutes, as we pushed them further and further back.
Barker.....very disappointing.
Celina.....non existant.
Bytyqi.....didn't look up to it.
A. Garcia tried, particularly late on, but overall too slow and predictable. You can see potential though.
Humphreys did ok when he came on.
Glendon looks comfortable, but didn't produce much.
Altogether, too easy for United, who obviously have license from their management, to put ten men behind the ball all game. They are not averse to just booting it anywhere upfield, which they increasingly did as the second half wore on.
Like the first team, we had lots of possession and passed around across the park but didn't penetrate the last third.

On a positive, I still like the look of Angelino and Adarbioyo and maybe Garcia.
Nobody else stood out.

Fair summary I think. I just finished watching it and was massively disappointed.To be fair we don't havce a great team at this level. All decent footballers and some with real potential but not really anything special from an individual or from the team approach.

The last match I saw Barker hinting that his confidence was coming back and by all accounts he was superb v Liverpool. I wonder why he didn't play tonight but let his younger sister play instead. He looked lost and with no confidence at all. His game is about taking people on ans threatening defences but he virtually didn't even try to and as suggested was sleepy off the ball a lot of the time.

Our midfield were anonymous in a creative attacking sense. Celina coming deep was about all we could hope for but the movement going forward was awful. Manu Garcia was off the pace and as he is coming back from injury I will let him off but I felt at times he was hiding and his touch and decision making when he did get involved just wasn't good enough.

Alex Garcia I also thought was a pretty insignificant player for at least the first half but did get more involved as the game wore on and Utd just sat back. We showed some decent bits and pieces but till the latter part the only thing I ever thought might bring a goal was Angelino on one of his runs. Just so disappointing overall against what I thought looked a poor Utd side as well. The only thing they were was strong and sort of well organised defensively.

[iwasthere2012]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

To add to that WW. I thought overall we were as lethargic as the first team. Particularly first half. Barker was isolated but was just strolling when he lost the ball.
Huge gap in the centre of the park first half.
United got onto the man on the ball very quickly.
Their goal was a result of a very disorganized defense. They could have scored earlier but for Gunn. Keane straight through after mix up in the midfield.
We created nothing first half.
Second half was one way traffic with City the only ones playing football, but there again we got nowhere near their goal until the last ten minutes, as we pushed them further and further back.
Barker.....very disappointing.
Celina.....non existant.
Bytyqi.....didn't look up to it.
A. Garcia tried, particularly late on, but overall too slow and predictable. You can see potential though.
Humphreys did ok when he came on.
Glendon looks comfortable, but didn't produce much.
Altogether, too easy for United, who obviously have license from their management, to put ten men behind the ball all game. They are not averse to just booting it anywhere upfield, which they increasingly did as the second half wore on.
Like the first team, we had lots of possession and passed around across the park but didn't penetrate the last third.

On a positive, I still like the look of Angelino and Adarbioyo and maybe Garcia.
Nobody else stood out.

Fair summary I think. I just finished watching it and was massively disappointed.To be fair we don't havce a great team at this level. All decent footballers and some with real potential but not really anything special from an individual or from the team approach.

The last match I saw Barker hinting that his confidence was coming back and by all accounts he was superb v Liverpool. I wonder why he didn't play tonight but let his younger sister play instead. He looked lost and with no confidence at all. His game is about taking people on ans threatening defences but he virtually didn't even try to and as suggested was sleepy off the ball a lot of the time.

Our midfield were anonymous in a creative attacking sense. Celina coming deep was about all we could hope for but the movement going forward was awful. Manu Garcia was off the pace and as he is coming back from injury I will let him off but I felt at times he was hiding and his touch and decision making when he did get involved just wasn't good enough.

Alex Garcia I also thought was a pretty insignificant player for at least the first half but did get more involved as the game wore on and Utd just sat back. We showed some decent bits and pieces but till the latter part the only thing I ever thought might bring a goal was Angelino on one of his runs. Just so disappointing overall against what I thought looked a poor Utd side as well. The only thing they were was strong and sort of well organised defensively.

A general question Doug, which I have hinted at before. Do yourself and WW and perhaps Twosips(where's he gone) and anyone else with an interest, think that at EDS level and perhaps 18/19's also, there is a naïvety in our play.
I'm not condoning it, but United looked like they are being thought how to win above all else. It's not what makes a great individual footballer but as a team they looked more like they had a plan than we did, particularly first half. The way our first team are playing at the moment, it's not really fair to make a comparison, but I can't help have this niggling doubt as to why we have not seen the introduction of more of our youngsters into the first team.
I know I'm not articulating very well what I have observed, but I don't think it's the skill level that's missing from the youths' game.
I think other youngsters from other teams are maybe forced to be more clued in at a cynical level, in their underage set ups. This in it's self is preparation for premiership football though.
It's just a thought. Interested to hear other opinions, particularly from those that see more games than me.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

To add to that WW. I thought overall we were as lethargic as the first team. Particularly first half. Barker was isolated but was just strolling when he lost the ball.
Huge gap in the centre of the park first half.
United got onto the man on the ball very quickly.
Their goal was a result of a very disorganized defense. They could have scored earlier but for Gunn. Keane straight through after mix up in the midfield.
We created nothing first half.
Second half was one way traffic with City the only ones playing football, but there again we got nowhere near their goal until the last ten minutes, as we pushed them further and further back.
Barker.....very disappointing.
Celina.....non existant.
Bytyqi.....didn't look up to it.
A. Garcia tried, particularly late on, but overall too slow and predictable. You can see potential though.
Humphreys did ok when he came on.
Glendon looks comfortable, but didn't produce much.
Altogether, too easy for United, who obviously have license from their management, to put ten men behind the ball all game. They are not averse to just booting it anywhere upfield, which they increasingly did as the second half wore on.
Like the first team, we had lots of possession and passed around across the park but didn't penetrate the last third.

On a positive, I still like the look of Angelino and Adarbioyo and maybe Garcia.
Nobody else stood out.

Fair summary I think. I just finished watching it and was massively disappointed.To be fair we don't havce a great team at this level. All decent footballers and some with real potential but not really anything special from an individual or from the team approach.

The last match I saw Barker hinting that his confidence was coming back and by all accounts he was superb v Liverpool. I wonder why he didn't play tonight but let his younger sister play instead. He looked lost and with no confidence at all. His game is about taking people on ans threatening defences but he virtually didn't even try to and as suggested was sleepy off the ball a lot of the time.

Our midfield were anonymous in a creative attacking sense. Celina coming deep was about all we could hope for but the movement going forward was awful. Manu Garcia was off the pace and as he is coming back from injury I will let him off but I felt at times he was hiding and his touch and decision making when he did get involved just wasn't good enough.

Alex Garcia I also thought was a pretty insignificant player for at least the first half but did get more involved as the game wore on and Utd just sat back. We showed some decent bits and pieces but till the latter part the only thing I ever thought might bring a goal was Angelino on one of his runs. Just so disappointing overall against what I thought looked a poor Utd side as well. The only thing they were was strong and sort of well organised defensively.

A general question Doug, which I have hinted at before. Do yourself and WW and perhaps Twosips(where's he gone) and anyone else with an interest, think that at EDS level and perhaps 18/19's also, there is a naïvety in our play.
I'm not condoning it, but United looked like they are being thought how to win above all else. It's not what makes a great individual footballer but as a team they looked more like they had a plan than we did, particularly first half. The way our first team are playing at the moment, it's not really fair to make a comparison, but I can't help have this niggling doubt as to why we have not seen the introduction of more of our youngsters into the first team.
I know I'm not articulating very well what I have observed, but I don't think it's the skill level that's missing from the youths' game.
I think other youngsters from other teams are maybe forced to be more clued in at a cynical level, in their underage set ups. This in it's self is preparation for premiership football though.
It's just a thought. Interested to hear other opinions, particularly from those that see more games than me.

I suspect there is at least some truth in what you are suggesting or fearing. Firstly there is absolutely no concern regarding the skill/quality level in our young players. It's there in abundance throughout the whole team even at 21's level but it's even more blatant as you go back down the age groups. You will be aware I am sure of how are under 16's and 15's are doing sweeping all before them.

Last year I think we played the scum at the swamp and were easily beaten as they played an over aged player or two,played similarly to last night on the break with a solid defensive approach. I thought that night we were much the better footballing side but seemingly just naive about how to combat their approach.

A week or so later ( as it will be next week) we played them in the return game at the CFA and we had a better team out.I can't remember how many different players wewre involved but one was Iheanacho. As a team we played much better and learned the lessons from the swamp defeat and in Iheanacho we had a match winner. You might recall he scored two special goals and we won 3.1.

Our under 19's team have performed very well in the champs league equivalent in the last 2 years. Walking the group with 6 wins out of 6 last season and winning the group this season.So somewhere in there we are showing we have not just talented players but players/teams that can win matches.The 18's this season are top of their league and through 3 rounds of the youth cup ( we lost in the final last season v Chelsea who I would say were deserved winners) and all of them were played away from home. In two of those games we came from behind which showed great character and desire to win. not against great sides but they were no pushover games.

The 21's team is a bit strange to me. I don't think winning games is the top of the agenda based on the number of times we play players out of position which I usually think is for their experience.We do also play players who I would not have in the "best" team plus of course we have some of our best under 21 players out on loan like Maffeo,Ntcham,Fofana ( i think those last 2 are still under21's) Ambrose and Boadu being injured really hurts our capability to get through strong defensive line ups.

I am sure other teams do similarly although we know the scum regularly have 3 or so over age and real senior players in the 21's team for various reasons. I am glad we don't do that. Just taking last night's game as an example and it seemed their whole game was about a strong organised and often physical defence which of course includes 9 players and not just a back 4. City look to play open attacking passing football and of course a big part of the learning development curve is how to combat such a defensive approach.

I am sure the teams come up with it even at the younger ages but there is a marked difference between 6 foot plus defenders at 18 years and older compared to say an under 16's/15's side. You find out a lot about players when the going gets tough ( did I really say that!) but I would not criticise them for lack of effort or desire to win.You only have to look at Kean Bryan last night as an example and I thought of Alex Garcia.

Somewhere in there though I thought we showed a lack of nous which might be in part down to coaching ( Not sure about Davies at all yet). I just didn't see the intensity needed and the movement needed to win games like that. Then of course we also picked a night to forget how to pass the ball and to control it instantly and basically play badly.

Hopefully we will see a different game next Saturday where we play well and show the red tossers how to play.

[iwasthere2012]

To be brutally honest the city team look berift of ideas in front of goal, boring to watch and only came alive in the last five mins.

To add to that WW. I thought overall we were as lethargic as the first team. Particularly first half. Barker was isolated but was just strolling when he lost the ball.
Huge gap in the centre of the park first half.
United got onto the man on the ball very quickly.
Their goal was a result of a very disorganized defense. They could have scored earlier but for Gunn. Keane straight through after mix up in the midfield.
We created nothing first half.
Second half was one way traffic with City the only ones playing football, but there again we got nowhere near their goal until the last ten minutes, as we pushed them further and further back.
Barker.....very disappointing.
Celina.....non existant.
Bytyqi.....didn't look up to it.
A. Garcia tried, particularly late on, but overall too slow and predictable. You can see potential though.
Humphreys did ok when he came on.
Glendon looks comfortable, but didn't produce much.
Altogether, too easy for United, who obviously have license from their management, to put ten men behind the ball all game. They are not averse to just booting it anywhere upfield, which they increasingly did as the second half wore on.
Like the first team, we had lots of possession and passed around across the park but didn't penetrate the last third.

On a positive, I still like the look of Angelino and Adarbioyo and maybe Garcia.
Nobody else stood out.

Fair summary I think. I just finished watching it and was massively disappointed.To be fair we don't havce a great team at this level. All decent footballers and some with real potential but not really anything special from an individual or from the team approach.

The last match I saw Barker hinting that his confidence was coming back and by all accounts he was superb v Liverpool. I wonder why he didn't play tonight but let his younger sister play instead. He looked lost and with no confidence at all. His game is about taking people on ans threatening defences but he virtually didn't even try to and as suggested was sleepy off the ball a lot of the time.

Our midfield were anonymous in a creative attacking sense. Celina coming deep was about all we could hope for but the movement going forward was awful. Manu Garcia was off the pace and as he is coming back from injury I will let him off but I felt at times he was hiding and his touch and decision making when he did get involved just wasn't good enough.

Alex Garcia I also thought was a pretty insignificant player for at least the first half but did get more involved as the game wore on and Utd just sat back. We showed some decent bits and pieces but till the latter part the only thing I ever thought might bring a goal was Angelino on one of his runs. Just so disappointing overall against what I thought looked a poor Utd side as well. The only thing they were was strong and sort of well organised defensively.

A general question Doug, which I have hinted at before. Do yourself and WW and perhaps Twosips(where's he gone) and anyone else with an interest, think that at EDS level and perhaps 18/19's also, there is a naïvety in our play.
I'm not condoning it, but United looked like they are being thought how to win above all else. It's not what makes a great individual footballer but as a team they looked more like they had a plan than we did, particularly first half. The way our first team are playing at the moment, it's not really fair to make a comparison, but I can't help have this niggling doubt as to why we have not seen the introduction of more of our youngsters into the first team.
I know I'm not articulating very well what I have observed, but I don't think it's the skill level that's missing from the youths' game.
I think other youngsters from other teams are maybe forced to be more clued in at a cynical level, in their underage set ups. This in it's self is preparation for premiership football though.
It's just a thought. Interested to hear other opinions, particularly from those that see more games than me.

I suspect there is at least some truth in what you are suggesting or fearing. Firstly there is absolutely no concern regarding the skill/quality level in our young players. It's there in abundance throughout the whole team even at 21's level but it's even more blatant as you go back down the age groups. You will be aware I am sure of how are under 16's and 15's are doing sweeping all before them.

Last year I think we played the scum at the swamp and were easily beaten as they played an over aged player or two,played similarly to last night on the break with a solid defensive approach. I thought that night we were much the better footballing side but seemingly just naive about how to combat their approach.

A week or so later ( as it will be next week) we played them in the return game at the CFA and we had a better team out.I can't remember how many different players wewre involved but one was Iheanacho. As a team we played much better and learned the lessons from the swamp defeat and in Iheanacho we had a match winner. You might recall he scored two special goals and we won 3.1.

Our under 19's team have performed very well in the champs league equivalent in the last 2 years. Walking the group with 6 wins out of 6 last season and winning the group this season.So somewhere in there we are showing we have not just talented players but players/teams that can win matches.The 18's this season are top of their league and through 3 rounds of the youth cup ( we lost in the final last season v Chelsea who I would say were deserved winners) and all of them were played away from home. In two of those games we came from behind which showed great character and desire to win. not against great sides but they were no pushover games.

The 21's team is a bit strange to me. I don't think winning games is the top of the agenda based on the number of times we play players out of position which I usually think is for their experience.We do also play players who I would not have in the "best" team plus of course we have some of our best under 21 players out on loan like Maffeo,Ntcham,Fofana ( i think those last 2 are still under21's) Ambrose and Boadu being injured really hurts our capability to get through strong defensive line ups.

I am sure other teams do similarly although we know the scum regularly have 3 or so over age and real senior players in the 21's team for various reasons. I am glad we don't do that. Just taking last night's game as an example and it seemed their whole game was about a strong organised and often physical defence which of course includes 9 players and not just a back 4. City look to play open attacking passing football and of course a big part of the learning development curve is how to combat such a defensive approach.

I am sure the teams come up with it even at the younger ages but there is a marked difference between 6 foot plus defenders at 18 years and older compared to say an under 16's/15's side. You find out a lot about players when the going gets tough ( did I really say that!) but I would not criticise them for lack of effort or desire to win.You only have to look at Kean Bryan last night as an example and I thought of Alex Garcia.

Somewhere in there though I thought we showed a lack of nous which might be in part down to coaching ( Not sure about Davies at all yet). I just didn't see the intensity needed and the movement needed to win games like that. Then of course we also picked a night to forget how to pass the ball and to control it instantly and basically play badly.

Hopefully we will see a different game next Saturday where we play well and show the red tossers how to play.

Nice balanced reply Doug and it makes sense.
I did see the two Rag games last season and the Chelsea final and a few others. I suppose the rag defeat last year and this year are prime examples of what I am talking about. From memory it was pretty much the same story against them although I remember Nacho in the return game last year, showing them up.
I think there is great talent through the age groups as is evident from how they are tearing it up and wish we could see more of it on tv.
I suppose the frustration I have is how slow we are, despite our annual injury crises, to play a nineteen year old when other teams successfully do it. I don't think a touch of cynicism at 19-21years of age is necessarily all bad, at team level. They should be taught how to win games and adjust their game where and when required depending on the opposition.
This is where my comparison with the real world of the PL falls apart though.
Our first team's game management is every bit as poor. Blame whoever you like for that. I think we are reluctant to throw youth in in those circumstances, where maybe the likes of United do, because their youth are more used to being told to play with the same cynicism, that their first team display.

Still doesn't sound like I'm explaining it right, but I'm sure you get the gist of what I'm on about.

[Blue Since 76]

Not worried about them not winning and there's little point in dropping a few overage players in there just to win things. But most of them looked ready to drop straight into the first team, and that's not meant as a compliment. Looks like we're trying to build the Spanish team from the World Cup, but picked the 2014 version.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

The one thing I am concerned about which you allude to is the apparent reluctance to involve the younger players unless we get desperate. Kelechi is the exception but even he should have played more because I think he is a special talent.

When we had full back problems we kept battling on with the two we had rather than give Maffeo a go so as not to overplay Sagna and Kolarov. I do get the feeling that City have decided young players need to be 20 or 21 or something like that before they might be considered ready.That means that potential players have to go on loan to develop like Evans,Fofana,Lopes,Ntcham. Whether they come back into the City fold and make it is in the lap of the gods. Evans did really well on loan as did Lopes but they have now gone and I think I expect the same for the other 2 I mentioned.

I think the Chelsea cup game will say a lot if Pellers is true to his word and plays a very young side. I will be fascinated to see who he picks.