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Posted: **Sun May 31, 2015 11:21 am**

Pretty Boy Lee wrote:
Im_Spartacus wrote:
Pretty Boy Lee wrote:Why do we seem to think he's annoyed here? He's not been here that long and he's not even been an assistant yet, nowhere near our top job imo.

On a related note what is the average stint in academies/lower gigs before walking into a big club gig? Have any other team in our position hired someone like this before? (Other than pep)

I just don't think it's realistic to expect anyone with the profile of Patrick Vieira be sitting behind the scenes for 6 years or so on the off chance that we MIGHT give him the nod not after this manager, but after the one after that.

What if Guardiola comes in and decides to stay for 5 years. Beyond that, what is Vieira going to learn as assistant manager, or whatever other role people seem to think he's earmarked for. Is that even a promotion given he loses the autonomy he has as head of the EDS?

Even if he doesn't go for this gig, will have his head turned plenty of times in the future until one day, he goes. What then for the big plan?

I don't expect him to sit for 6 years, but why not make him assistant next season and see what he's got in him at this stage? Or offer him that job under whoever we bring in the season following if pellers isn't extending? If we're really doing 3 yet cycles he could build up step by step in the next 4 and be in one of the best gigs in the world buh then end of that time.

You haven't explained how assistant manager is a 'promotion' compared to what he's doing now - his current job is arguably the most important coaching job at the club right now with very high stakes for the club.

We forget that as a player he was captain under one of the best technical managers of this generation. If several years in the arsenal dressing room as captain, and 3 years doing his time for our reserves don't leave him ready, I honestly don't know what will. But what will happen, is clubs will increasingly look to poach him....and eventually an opportunity will come up that takes his fancy.

Will managing the kids, or being assistant manager for another 3 years make him a better manager in the end? I'd argue that there is simply no evidence at all to back that viewpoint.

Posted: **Sun May 31, 2015 11:42 am**

Here's an article on PV that i hadn't read before, should he go (Newcastle or anywhere else), could we get a formal arrangement to have back one day if he succeeds (like most people think he will)? Article published 17thApril btw...

PATRICK VIEIRA MIXING EXPERIENCE AND RESPECT FROM HIS PLAYING DAYS WITH HARD WORK LEARNING TECHNICAL DETAILS OF COACHING"

HIS name is one of many being thrown into the hat in speculative stories about the role of manager at Manchester City, but Patrick Vieira is just getting his head down on earning his coaching badges.

The former Arsenal star is working on his coaching qualifications with the Welsh FA, where he is nearing the end of his UEFA Pro Licence course, the highest qualification attainable from European football’s governing body.

Vieira, who followed his time at Arsenal with five years in Italy at Juventus and then Inter, is currently Head of the Elite Development Squad at Manchester City, the club he brought his playing career to an end at.

Vieira’s squad have their eyes on a range of silverware and moved a step closer to one piece of it with a 5-3 penalty shootout win over Glasgow Celtic last night in the International Premier League Cup. They currently sit top of the Barclays U21 Premier League and face Chelsea later this month in the two-legged final of the FA Youth Cup.

For a club like Manchester City, whose achievements at senior level are often downplayed because of the wealth of their owners, developing young players is one way to silence the critics. Their owners haven’t just invested in expensive first team signings, they’ve also invested a lot of time and money in an attempt to create an academy setup that other top clubs can only look at with envy.

Earlier this year they opened the City Football Academy, a purpose built facility that cost over £200m. The facility is also for the use of the first team but the club say two thirds of the complex is dedicated to youth development, meaning there are more than a dozen pitches available for the club’s youngsters. It also features a 7,000-capacity stadium which will be used for games for the Elite Development squad and the Manchester City Women’s team, as well as for the community.

Yet all of that investment will count for little if the club don’t ensure they have the right people running it and no doubt there will be changes from time to time – just as there are at any club as the right balance is found.

Vieira is often said to be highly-regarded by the club’s owners and the chief executive Ferran Soriano, not just because of his success with the youngsters but also because of his approach and his attitude to the role.

Now, with City’s title bid all but over off the back of a slump in form all the talk is about them looking for a new manager, and one of the names in the frame, the papers claim, is Vieira.

Whether there is any truth in any of this is, of course, something only the club itself really knows and it may well be that they won’t even be looking for a new manager this summer. If they are, they may be looking for someone with experience and success as a first team coach at an elite level rather than someone who has been quietly developing his coaching skills for the past few seasons.

Whatever happens, it seems clear that sooner or later the Frenchman will be the head coach somewhere in the world and when he is, he’ll be able to draw on his experience as a player to help deal with the kind of pressure an elite coach is under in the modern game.

What he doesn’t want is any special treatment.

When he was doing his UEFA ‘A’ Licence, the level before the ‘Pro’ Licence and a course he also did with the Welsh FA, he explained his reasons for choosing Dragon Park over St George’s Park or elsewhere: “I'm really open and I want to learn and this is the best place for me to do it,” he said.

“I've experience on the field that will help me to deal with certain situations but I don't have any experience on the bench – how to set up a training session, how to deal with the players, and this is why I'm doing the course.”

Last year the FAW introduced Globall Coach to their courses, technology that gives the coaches the tools to plan sessions, create drills, explain tactics, analyse opposition and review games.

Vieira’s colleagues on the course include current Aston Villa boss Tim Sherwood, Swansea manager Garry Monk and QPR Director of Football Les Ferdinand, alongside coaches and analysts from Arsenal, Everton and Liverpool and current Welsh Women’s national team, Jayne Ludlow.

Names well known to football supporters – like Craig Bellamy and Sol Campbell – rub shoulders with coaches from sides playing in the Welsh Premier League, a world away from the riches of the English Premier League, but no less competitive.

This mix seems to appeal to Vieira: “I chose a place where I feel comfortable to learn, where there is no egos and where they treat everyone the same.”

Egos will, of course, be something Patrick has to deal with when his time as a head coach does arrive, but he had to deal with plenty of those during his playing days.

He’ll also draw on the experience he has had with some of football’s best-known coaches: “My coaching style is a combination from my experience of working with Arsene Wenger, Fabio Capello and Jose Mourinho,” he said.

“There is a little bit of all of them, plus my own experience to deliver my message.

“The relationship with the players is so important. I want to trust them but they must trust me, too. I like it because I want to be close with them.”

Current Manchester City goalkeeper Joe Hart has witness Vieira’s ability to get his players to listen. “He’s a jokey kind of guy,” Hart said. “Very laid back, but he has this thing about him where, if all of a sudden he decides to be serious and talk, he just takes over the whole room. He has that respect from all the players, still now.”

Vieira will be technically qualified to manage at any top flight club in Europe from this summer, meeting all the requirements UEFA demand and a little bit more too. Not just because of his personal experience in the game, but also because the FAW offer their students much more than a box-ticking exercise to meet UEFA accreditation criteria.

As Vieira said: “That is what I like, because there are 24 people in the room and we may have 24 different visions. There is not only one way to coach.

“They teach you to be a coach with your personality and who you are and they try to give you tools for you to put your philosophy on the table.”

When Vieira does make that step-up to head coach, wherever it may be, he’ll be better equipped than many others wearing those shoes for the first time.

https://www.globallcoach.com/archive/vi ... y-coaching

Posted: **Sun May 31, 2015 12:37 pm**

Ted Hughes wrote:If he does anything other than fail at Newcastle, then he has some serious talent.

For anyone talking about Vieira being upset or walking out or refusing to sign contracts etc etc; there is enough imformation available to you, which should be easily able to quash any fears of any such things happening.

I posted a big article on Vieira talking to Martin Keown at the opening of the Academy, this season, where all of this kind of stuff was dealt with, not just by Vieira. I can't be arsed finding it as I'm working away, but it's on here & if anyone really wants to know about Vieira's situation with City rather than just panicking, they should find it. The theme is that Vieira is now 100% City, feels he owes us & would never do anything without City's consent.

He also said you don't go from academy manager, to managing Manchester City.

If Vieira does leave, it is to test himself, & if we want him back in the future, we will get him back.

Why is he linked to anyone with what you have repeated above, does not tally. He should have his future mapped out with surely.

Posted: **Sun May 31, 2015 9:10 pm**

Im_Spartacus wrote:
Pretty Boy Lee wrote:
Im_Spartacus wrote:
Pretty Boy Lee wrote:Why do we seem to think he's annoyed here? He's not been here that long and he's not even been an assistant yet, nowhere near our top job imo.

On a related note what is the average stint in academies/lower gigs before walking into a big club gig? Have any other team in our position hired someone like this before? (Other than pep)

I just don't think it's realistic to expect anyone with the profile of Patrick Vieira be sitting behind the scenes for 6 years or so on the off chance that we MIGHT give him the nod not after this manager, but after the one after that.

What if Guardiola comes in and decides to stay for 5 years. Beyond that, what is Vieira going to learn as assistant manager, or whatever other role people seem to think he's earmarked for. Is that even a promotion given he loses the autonomy he has as head of the EDS?

Even if he doesn't go for this gig, will have his head turned plenty of times in the future until one day, he goes. What then for the big plan?

I don't expect him to sit for 6 years, but why not make him assistant next season and see what he's got in him at this stage? Or offer him that job under whoever we bring in the season following if pellers isn't extending? If we're really doing 3 yet cycles he could build up step by step in the next 4 and be in one of the best gigs in the world buh then end of that time.

You haven't explained how assistant manager is a 'promotion' compared to what he's doing now - his current job is arguably the most important coaching job at the club right now with very high stakes for the club.

We forget that as a player he was captain under one of the best technical managers of this generation. If several years in the arsenal dressing room as captain, and 3 years doing his time for our reserves don't leave him ready, I honestly don't know what will. But what will happen, is clubs will increasingly look to poach him....and eventually an opportunity will come up that takes his fancy.

Will managing the kids, or being assistant manager for another 3 years make him a better manager in the end? I'd argue that there is simply no evidence at all to back that viewpoint.

You don't think putting on training sessions, doung team talks, media etc for the 1st team is a promotion on the road to being in charges of that same team?

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:39 am**

working with such a club will help him in no way if he returned to City, we did things like Newcastle 10 yrs ago, that ship has well and truly been sunk.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 9:59 am**

Hazy2 wrote:working with such a club will help him in no way if he returned to City, we did things like Newcastle 10 yrs ago, that ship has well and truly been sunk.

He has spent years learning every aspect of how City do things, probably to an extent never before seen in football & is actually one of the people involved in doing the things City do.

But he's done fuck all as far as senior player management. Hence this kind of idea.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:10 am**

The comedy show that is Noocassle is not the best place to start for PV but I can understand the attraction of the job for him if they are promising to let him have a free hand. Will be a complete culture shock going from Arse to City then the bargain bin at Sports Direct...

Hopefully just anti-City sh*t stirring.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:18 am**

Ted Hughes wrote:If he does anything other than fail at Newcastle, then he has some serious talent.

For anyone talking about Vieira being upset or walking out or refusing to sign contracts etc etc; there is enough imformation available to you, which should be easily able to quash any fears of any such things happening.

I posted a big article on Vieira talking to Martin Keown at the opening of the Academy, this season, where all of this kind of stuff was dealt with, not just by Vieira. I can't be arsed finding it as I'm working away, but it's on here & if anyone really wants to know about Vieira's situation with City rather than just panicking, they should find it. The theme is that Vieira is now 100% City, feels he owes us & would never do anything without City's consent.

He also said you don't go from academy manager, to managing Manchester City.

If Vieira does leave, it is to test himself, & if we want him back in the future, we will get him back.

If the managerial ability is there it wouldnt surprise me if he is Arsenals next manager in a couple of years or so.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 12:19 pm**

Ted Hughes wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:working with such a club will help him in no way if he returned to City, we did things like Newcastle 10 yrs ago, that ship has well and truly been sunk.

He has spent years learning every aspect of how City do things, probably to an extent never before seen in football & is actually one of the people involved in doing the things City do.

But he's done fuck all as far as senior player management. Hence this kind of idea.

No Ted, that would be like giving a used Tyre fitter the keys to a Porsche 911 and asking him to change the coils, Newcastle would not help him in managing City, He has his stripes, T Shirt and more. That NUTHOUSE would unhinge him IMO.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:58 pm**

Just read this thread with interest as I have just got back from 4 days in Newcastle for the Rugby Super League Magic Weekend . Spent a lot of time in various Newcastle city center drinking establishments and got talking to quite a few geordies who haven't got a fucking clue about rugby league but nevermind lol . Anyways NUFC huge club , St James Park huge ground , huge support ..........majority of geordies lovely welcoming people but totally fucking deluded about "their" football club with a we get 55.000 "proper" fans every week and we are the best supported club in the premier league attitude ! I seriously got more sense talking to a wall lol . Ashley is truly hated massive big time up there so imho Paddy give the place a wide berth big time !!!! the place is like a lost world up there with a serious chip on its shoulder ;-)

Fab place for a piss up tho !

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:37 pm**

Mike J wrote:
Ted Hughes wrote:If he does anything other than fail at Newcastle, then he has some serious talent.

For anyone talking about Vieira being upset or walking out or refusing to sign contracts etc etc; there is enough imformation available to you, which should be easily able to quash any fears of any such things happening.

I posted a big article on Vieira talking to Martin Keown at the opening of the Academy, this season, where all of this kind of stuff was dealt with, not just by Vieira. I can't be arsed finding it as I'm working away, but it's on here & if anyone really wants to know about Vieira's situation with City rather than just panicking, they should find it. The theme is that Vieira is now 100% City, feels he owes us & would never do anything without City's consent.

He also said you don't go from academy manager, to managing Manchester City.

If Vieira does leave, it is to test himself, & if we want him back in the future, we will get him back.

If the managerial ability is there it wouldnt surprise me if he is Arsenals next manager in a couple of years or so.

If City don't want him then he is free to go anywhere. If you are making that assumption because you believe Vieira to be an Arsenal man though, you couldn't be more wrong.

City are Vieira's club now & this is where he will end up, as manager, if he is allowed to.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:47 pm**

Hazy2 wrote:
Ted Hughes wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:working with such a club will help him in no way if he returned to City, we did things like Newcastle 10 yrs ago, that ship has well and truly been sunk.

He has spent years learning every aspect of how City do things, probably to an extent never before seen in football & is actually one of the people involved in doing the things City do.

But he's done fuck all as far as senior player management. Hence this kind of idea.

No Ted, that would be like giving a used Tyre fitter the keys to a Porsche 911 and asking him to change the coils, Newcastle would not help him in managing City, He has his stripes, T Shirt and more. That NUTHOUSE would unhinge him IMO.

No he doesn't.

He's never managed a senior football team in his life. All he has done is send a bunch of kids out to play mostly the way City's other academy teams do, against another bunch of kids. Jason Wilcox can do anything Vieira has done at that level, no problem at all.

A difficult situation at a big club would be a fantastic learning experience. But Newcastle would be taking a huge risk giving Vieira the job. They are hardly awash with talent to rescue a situation if his methods don't work. And the methods City use are designed for quality players, not mid table players.

If Vieira can adapt his philosophy to get results with inferior players, then it will prove he has real talent.

I think McClaren will get the job anyway.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:19 pm**

Good luck to him if he goes. Choice of waiting with us or having a crack in the PL. I think any ambitious guy would want to test themselves.
Like an earlier poster I could well see him back at Arsenal just as much as at City. He's still revered there and Arsene won't be going on for much longer.

Vieira's choice?
1. Stay at City in an underling job and maybe get a crack at manager in 4 years or so.
2. Try to prove himself now and if he does then have a wider choice of future opportunities - both home and abroad

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:59 pm**

Ted Hughes wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:
Ted Hughes wrote:
Hazy2 wrote:working with such a club will help him in no way if he returned to City, we did things like Newcastle 10 yrs ago, that ship has well and truly been sunk.

He has spent years learning every aspect of how City do things, probably to an extent never before seen in football & is actually one of the people involved in doing the things City do.

But he's done fuck all as far as senior player management. Hence this kind of idea.

No Ted, that would be like giving a used Tyre fitter the keys to a Porsche 911 and asking him to change the coils, Newcastle would not help him in managing City, He has his stripes, T Shirt and more. That NUTHOUSE would unhinge him IMO.

No he doesn't.

He's never managed a senior football team in his life. All he has done is send a bunch of kids out to play mostly the way City's other academy teams do, against another bunch of kids. Jason Wilcox can do anything Vieira has done at that level, no problem at all.

A difficult situation at a big club would be a fantastic learning experience. But Newcastle would be taking a huge risk giving Vieira the job. They are hardly awash with talent to rescue a situation if his methods don't work. And the methods City use are designed for quality players, not mid table players.

If Vieira can adapt his philosophy to get results with inferior players, then it will prove he has real talent.

I think McClaren will get the job anyway.

Just as likely he will get to Jan realise he has been had and walk out to a role like the one he has,,poss at another club, Newcastle is a car crash club with relegation and blame wrote all over it.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 6:35 pm**

Without wanting to sound snide - can anyone explain how he's done "brilliantly" at the academy? We seem to be regularly 2nd place to other teams youth squads and no-one appears close to breaking into the first team. I am quite sure I am being harsh...?

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:44 pm**

bayblue wrote:Good luck to him if he goes. Choice of waiting with us or having a crack in the PL. I think any ambitious guy would want to test themselves.
Like an earlier poster I could well see him back at Arsenal just as much as at City. He's still revered there and Arsene won't be going on for much longer.

Vieira's choice?
1. Stay at City in an underling job and maybe get a crack at manager in 4 years or so.
2. Try to prove himself now and if he does then have a wider choice of future opportunities - both home and abroad

or
3. Try to prove himself now, get undone by a nutcase owner, unrealistic fan expectation, lack of money and inconsistent players and set his career back several years.

Posted: **Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:54 pm**

City64 wrote:Just read this thread with interest as I have just got back from 4 days in Newcastle for the Rugby Super League Magic Weekend . Spent a lot of time in various Newcastle city center drinking establishments and got talking to quite a few geordies who haven't got a fucking clue about rugby league but nevermind lol . Anyways NUFC huge club , St James Park huge ground , huge support ..........majority of geordies lovely welcoming people but totally fucking deluded about "their" football club with a we get 55.000 "proper" fans every week and we are the best supported club in the premier league attitude ! I seriously got more sense talking to a wall lol . Ashley is truly hated massive big time up there so imho Paddy give the place a wide berth big time !!!! the place is like a lost world up there with a serious chip on its shoulder ;-)

Fab place for a piss up tho !

You should have pointed out that before Keegan and the Premier League turned up they were getting crowds of less than 10,000.

Posted: **Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:21 am**

Peter Doherty (AGAIG) wrote:
City64 wrote:Just read this thread with interest as I have just got back from 4 days in Newcastle for the Rugby Super League Magic Weekend . Spent a lot of time in various Newcastle city center drinking establishments and got talking to quite a few geordies who haven't got a fucking clue about rugby league but nevermind lol . Anyways NUFC huge club , St James Park huge ground , huge support ..........majority of geordies lovely welcoming people but totally fucking deluded about "their" football club with a we get 55.000 "proper" fans every week and we are the best supported club in the premier league attitude ! I seriously got more sense talking to a wall lol . Ashley is truly hated massive big time up there so imho Paddy give the place a wide berth big time !!!! the place is like a lost world up there with a serious chip on its shoulder ;-)

Fab place for a piss up tho !

You should have pointed out that before Keegan and the Premier League turned up they were getting crowds of less than 10,000.

Honestly mate they are brain dead almost bigoted . Apparently Bury , Sale and Middleton aren't in Manchester according to those thick cunts up there !!! Thats the level of convo in the bars with them lot , they seriously haven't got a clue .........it's no wonder Ashley takes the piss out of them !

Posted: **Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:35 am**

Hazy2 wrote:
Just as likely he will get to Jan realise he has been had and walk out to a role like the one he has,,poss at another club, Newcastle is a car crash club with relegation and blame wrote all over it.

If Vieira is so dumb, that after playing for years in this country, working for City behind the scenes , & hearing all the business talk on the grapevine from his contacts in the game, he doesn't understand what he is walking into at Newcastle & needs advice from City fans to tell him about the possible dangers; is that the kind of bloke you would want as City manager ?

Vieira will decide what he wants to do. If he goes there, he knows exactly who Mike Ashley is & what he does & still thinks he can learn from the move. If he decides it's no use to him, he won't go.

Posted: **Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:58 am**

City64 wrote:
Peter Doherty (AGAIG) wrote:
City64 wrote:Just read this thread with interest as I have just got back from 4 days in Newcastle for the Rugby Super League Magic Weekend . Spent a lot of time in various Newcastle city center drinking establishments and got talking to quite a few geordies who haven't got a fucking clue about rugby league but nevermind lol . Anyways NUFC huge club , St James Park huge ground , huge support ..........majority of geordies lovely welcoming people but totally fucking deluded about "their" football club with a we get 55.000 "proper" fans every week and we are the best supported club in the premier league attitude ! I seriously got more sense talking to a wall lol . Ashley is truly hated massive big time up there so imho Paddy give the place a wide berth big time !!!! the place is like a lost world up there with a serious chip on its shoulder ;-)

Fab place for a piss up tho !

You should have pointed out that before Keegan and the Premier League turned up they were getting crowds of less than 10,000.

Honestly mate they are brain dead almost bigoted . Apparently Bury , Sale and Middleton aren't in Manchester according to those thick cunts up there !!! Thats the level of convo in the bars with them lot , they seriously haven't got a clue .........it's no wonder Ashley takes the piss out of them !

Taylor was told in a phone call that he was being let go and was asked if he could pass the phone to Guitierrez so they could tell him he was surplus to requirements, too. Classy outfit.

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