Silva

[Ted Hughes]

Ted, Silva can do all of those things, look at his cross on sunday. Our prob has been relying on the c-nt and playing through him and Navas. Silver will give you crosses because he gets to great places to deliver them. He will score ten goals. He can take free kicks from the right position. You've hit the nail on the head, de Bruyne has weaknesses. That's the point. They all do. Does anyone seriously think Pogba is the finished article?Our main problems have been Toure, Navas, Dzeko and Nasri. They are toast. None should ever play for City again. Dave will be fine in my view and I really struggle when people slag him and then say Fernandinho was "immense"( I know you are not doing that, just trying to have a rational conversation) I don't think its even true he doesn't track or tackle. He aint the greatest but he has a go, like xavi for example. in a 433 Silva gets into any of the two threes 95% of the time for me.

Well if we are looking at a front 3, where does he get in Real Madrid, Barca, or Bayern Munich's teams ?

I can't have it that Silva takes free kicks by the way. He does, but he shouldn't, ever. We should have 4 or 5 in front of him & that has always been one of the biggest weaknesses of this City team. Yaya did a bit of work on it last season & the difference it made was spectacular.

We need the same quality on general delivery & now someone to do what Yaya briefly did. That isn't something Silva gives us.

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

One of the finest players in the club's history and people are seriously talking of dropping him and/or selling him on? It's a price life to watch him and so much that is good comes through him.
He is not the problem in our side by any stretch of the imagination.
Get a grip.

[Ted Hughes]

One of the finest players in the club's history and people are seriously talking of dropping him and/or selling him on? It's a price life to watch him and so much that is good comes through him.
He is not the problem in our side by any stretch of the imagination.
Get a grip.

I'm not talking of dropping him or selling him no.

I'm saying that most managers with a system in mind and a blank chequebook wouldn't sign Silva to play in it, unless they were building it around him, as he doesn't have a position, so the team has to be unbalanced to accomodate him.

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

If Silva was thought to be available, there would be no shortage of top clubs wanting to sign him. Furthermore we would look bloody mad to even contemplate it.

[Ted Hughes]

If Silva was thought to be available, there would be no shortage of top clubs wanting to sign him. Furthermore we would look bloody mad to even contemplate it.

Lots of top clubs would be in for him but probably not the ones who win the top trophies. We are a top club.

[DoomMerchant]

If Silva was thought to be available, there would be no shortage of top clubs wanting to sign him. Furthermore we would look bloody mad to even contemplate it.

Lots of top clubs would be in for him but probably not the ones who win the top trophies. We are a top club.

So who wouldn't, in your estimation, Prince Ted?

Barca, Real and Bayern wouldn't?

Okay. Great. You might...actually even be wrong on that point. So, there's that.

cheers

[Original Dub]

He is suffering from having players that have run out of ideas around him, just like Aguero. Their movement is world class and they are the only world class players we now have

Silva is also very adaptable, so IMO it's not so much the systems that take him in and out of games, but the correct players around him.

For example, if we had Bale playing in the same team as Silva, with the ability to tear into space created, he would have twice as many assists and have twice as much space himself. Toure flirted with this and it worked for a couple of seasons.

Now that teams don't have to worry about the space that Toure is going to exploit, they can go back to concentrating on stopping Silva. And everyone knows, for many a season now, if you stop Silva playing you stop City to a large extent.
We are only over reliant on him because he is the only world class talent we have capable of opening up defences and midfield with a pass.

We sell him and Barca, Bayern and Real would definitely be in for him. Then, we'd have one less world class player and our rivals would have one more.

The problem isn't Silva, the problem is we only have one Silva, when we need more.

[PrezIke]

I can see what Ted is saying. I take him to be better than Mata, but they are similar in that they offer certain strengths of great brilliance, but also weaknesses that put them in a place where you want them to be, ideally, a No. 10, but with certain types of players surrounding them.

Barca and Real play a 4-3-3 and while he could play in that, is that the way to cater to his strengths?

I think he might fit better into a 4-3-1-2, which Bayern use, I believe.

Generally, he's not the biggest problem, but at his age to build around him is not likely, but if we add different types of world class/quality players to suit a plan B for the team then he will fit in just fine as he is a wonderful player overall. A key problem to me is that our squad drops off in quality quickly when we have to go to a plan B, so Pellegrini -- if you ask me -- ends up sticking to plan A, despite some of our best attacking players lacking work rate.

[getdressedmctavish]

Ted, you nailed it when you said Ya Ya did some work on his free kicks. Look at the results and look at the lack of results when no work is done. Dave, with work, would be perfect for bending it in from the right, but how much do they practice???One of the things missing this season on the evidence of what we see. Would he get in a RM front three. No cos they have the best player in the world but he might anyway given what the Spaniards think of Bale. Imo he could do a lot of different things in the right set up as one of two or even three scoring players apart from Aguero and as a play making mf. My worry is whether Fernandinho is ever gonna step up, Dave's the least of our worries..

[Ted Hughes]

Ted, you nailed it when you said Ya Ya did some work on his free kicks. Look at the results and look at the lack of results when no work is done. Dave, with work, would be perfect for bending it in from the right, but how much do they practice???One of the things missing this season on the evidence of what we see. Would he get in a RM front three. No cos they have the best player in the world but he might anyway given what the Spaniards think of Bale. Imo he could do a lot of different things in the right set up as one of two or even three scoring players apart from Aguero and as a play making mf. My worry is whether Fernandinho is ever gonna step up, Dave's the least of our worries..

Setup doesn't stop him practicing free kicks or anything else. He either practices & can't do it or he doesn't practice.

People keep replying as if I've said Silva is shite & City's weakest player. He is one of the best players in the world.

My o.p. spells out exactly what I'm talking about. Get a blank sheet of paper, pick a system, think of the best or second or third best player we could get in each position in each system, to do the best allround job within that system, & then do the same & find a place for Silva in it instead: 442, 433, he doesn't play, 451 with Pep as the manager possibly, side built purely to accomodate him, definitely or as Doug said; 460 ideal.

[Ted Hughes]

If Silva was thought to be available, there would be no shortage of top clubs wanting to sign him. Furthermore we would look bloody mad to even contemplate it.

Lots of top clubs would be in for him but probably not the ones who win the top trophies. We are a top club.

So who wouldn't, in your estimation, Prince Ted?

Barca, Real and Bayern wouldn't?

Okay. Great. You might...actually even be wrong on that point. So, there's that.

cheers

Well tbh they probably would, because they can. Then they would play their usual system, with their usual players, & either Silva would solve all the points I've raised, or he would play vs the duffers, & to fill in for injured players. They would NOT under any circumstances, change their system to accomodate him. He plays as an attacking player for City. He wants to play there. If he signed for any of those teams, they would tell him what job he was doing & if he didn't work his tits off doing it, & be great at it, he would be out.

Barca are not dropping Neymar or Messi for Silva.

[getdressedmctavish]

No, and we aren't getting either Barca boy, or Tranny Course he gets in any front three we are likely to field. We have one wide player and one central player, Dave plays behind the striker, in the left when the winger goes right, in the right feeding the overlapping back when the wide man goes left. The most important thing is that the wide man can invert track and score. Navas can do one of those which is why good players are looking limited.If we play two strikers he needs two more defensive mids and he gets the third birth. Course he can play diagonals, remember the pass to Dzeko im the 6-1.God knows why people are talking about Modric, he's a scuffler compared to Dave.If the question is, is he athletic and powerful enough, the answer is no, but where can you find an athletic, powerful midfielder who can pass and control a ball like Dave. And don't say Iniesta because how good did he look when Messi was fucked?At the moment I would say only Hart( don't buy all the criticism of him) Dave and Sergio are nailed on to start.Its the rest we need to think about.

[ben the blue]

Some exellent posts on here as usual and its plain to see that 90% of city fans can all see the gapping holes in our team weather it be formation or application . This team is now ready for a shake up from top to bottom and im really looking forward to what happens in the summer I said it a while ago on the MEN disquss forums that pellugrini is shit Silva don't work hard enough yaya is now byby toure kolarov dzecko jovetic all must be moved on and some serious players and a manager to suit must drive our fantastic club forward

[Ted Hughes]

No, and we aren't getting either Barca boy, or Tranny Course he gets in any front three we are likely to field. We have one wide player and one central player, Dave plays behind the striker, in the left when the winger goes right, in the right feeding the overlapping back when the wide man goes left. The most important thing is that the wide man can invert track and score. Navas can do one of those which is why good players are looking limited.If we play two strikers he needs two more defensive mids and he gets the third birth. Course he can play diagonals, remember the pass to Dzeko im the 6-1.God knows why people are talking about Modric, he's a scuffler compared to Dave.If the question is, is he athletic and powerful enough, the answer is no, but where can you find an athletic, powerful midfielder who can pass and control a ball like Dave. And don't say Iniesta because how good did he look when Messi was fucked?At the moment I would say only Hart( don't buy all the criticism of him) Dave and Sergio are nailed on to start.Its the rest we need to think about.

He doesn't get in any other front 3 we could possibly build with signings at City though. We would be much better with a front 3 who are lightning fast, & score loads of goals, put in crosses etc, shoot, & can take set pieces. That's what Barca would go for, Real, Bayern, even Chelsea or rags, Arsenal, anyone who decided to send out an 11 in that system. You want Robben, Ribery, for that job, not Silva.

Similarly, you want Ronaldinho, Totti, even fucking Cantona as your 'luxury' player in a different system.

You were suggesting Silva as a deeper player in the Iniesta mode. He can do that job with his eyes shut, but he has to graft for 90 mins.

I think we will see one more season, at most, of the so called 442 (which isnt) then we will play a different system & Silva will have several potential jobs he can make his own & even become a veteran playmaker if he gets his head round it. But he will need to make himself indespensible in a particular job. Or he'll fade away.

He is absolutely one of the best players around, but not so good that a real top of the world side will change its balance just to suit him. For Messi, Ronaldinho yes . For Silva no.

[guv111]

Great first touch, superb at making short passes, amazingly slow, can't/doesn't like to shoot.

He's okay.

[kinkylola]

i wouldn't say he's slow ... he just has one speed.

[guv111]

To elaborate. Silva is a great player in a team full of spark and drive. This season, at least, he has largely failed to provide anything much in the way of spark or drive himself. The same can be said of Aguero, who some might argue isn't extending himself in case he injures himself badly again and thus fails to secure a lucrative move in the summer.

But then it's been a shit season. Somehow even worse than Mancini's last, when at least we were assured of second place and had an FA Cup final to look forward to at this stage. Now Dave and his mates are two years older, with a flaky captain who is 30 next year. Just like Dave himself.

We either quickly get quality players to support and bring out the best in Silva, Aguero and Kompany, or they will continue to be either a) a shadow of their former selves or b) liabilities.

That's what either Pellegrini or his successor must achieve within four or five months.

[PeterParker]

Interesting that he was NOT a starter in the Spain team that won the cups in 2008 and 2010, but he was in 2012.

That a fact, i think he might be the best playmaker we ever had and weird enough, we are having this discussion about him after his best season here, imho. He scored more than he usually does, really good season, but he was poor lately.

That been said, there is no one like him in the world.

[Ted Hughes]

Interesting that he was NOT a starter in the Spain team that won the cups in 2008 and 2010, but he was in 2012.

That a fact, i think he might be the best playmaker we ever had and weird enough, we are having this discussion about him after his best season here, imho. He scored more than he usually does, really good season, but he was poor lately.

That been said, there is no one like him in the world.

He has less assists than Navas.

[DoomMerchant]

Interesting that he was NOT a starter in the Spain team that won the cups in 2008 and 2010, but he was in 2012.

That a fact, i think he might be the best playmaker we ever had and weird enough, we are having this discussion about him after his best season here, imho. He scored more than he usually does, really good season, but he was poor lately.

That been said, there is no one like him in the world.

a team dominated by Xavi and Iniesta in his roles in midfield? Yes, that's...very...interesting.

He started to get into the side when they played more "sans strikers" as you might say, and had success doing it as well. Which we did also. Coincidence?

Maybe this proves Ted's cunty points...if you don't build around him you aren't going to get the best from him, and who has the luxury of something like that? West Ham? Everton? etc

cheers