Is it time to start again?

[AntMcfc]

Sign Pogba and Reus, that's imperitive. We should be spending whatever it takes - £100m if we have to - to sign them. We have the money and we have the players available to sell. Personally I'd be shipping Dzeko, Silva, Kolarov and Jovetic. That's enough to recoup a lot of the money spent, but the squad barely loses anything. We'd then have a lot more flexibility, we'd have a blend of youth and experience, pace and possession, directness and comfort. Would obviously like more squad players to replace the outgoing players but I won't go into specifics.

[Wonderwall]

Sign Pogba and Reus, that's imperitive. We should be spending whatever it takes - £100m if we have to - to sign them. We have the money and we have the players available to sell. Personally I'd be shipping Dzeko, Silva, Kolarov and Jovetic. That's enough to recoup a lot of the money spent, but the squad barely loses anything. We'd then have a lot more flexibility, we'd have a blend of youth and experience, pace and possession, directness and comfort. Would obviously like more squad players to replace the outgoing players but I won't go into specifics.

you have just got rid of 2 strikers, a left back and our most creative ever player and signed 2 midfielders?

I like Pogba and Reus and would love us to sign them, but get rid of Silva? Really?

[dick dastardley]

Get rid of silva!!!! Are you all mad he's scored goals this season and our playmaker, Nasri is a deffo to go along with the balkans

[gmercer1]

Amazed at he number of people that want Silva out...............he's my fave :-(

[Blue Since 76]

Bit of a mad idea, but could we pick a formation (Ted alert) and then buy and sell players based on the needs of that? If we want to play two in the middle and two up top, there's no need for Silva, Yaya or Nasri, but we do need proper wingers and hard working midfielders. If we're going for one up top with 1/2/3 behind then they or similar players have a place.

Replacing Yaya or Silva with Messi isn't going to solve the issues if we play him on the wing or in a two in the middle and need him to track back.

[Ted Hughes]

If we did that, imagine if we had to change the formation ?

Just for the record, I'm absolutely not against changing formations or a particular fan of 4222 I'm just against utter fucking bullshit. And people claiming you 'can't' play this system & that system v Barca or whoever, are talking out of their fucking arseholes, & people who claim 451 will definitely work & therefore they are tactically superior to the manager, every time he doesn't use it, are also talking out of their fucking arseholes. It works sometimes & doesn't work others, just like our other formations, of which there have been many.

I think a problem we have is that our best players together don't aparticularly suit ANY formation. And the only one any combo of strikers suits, is so called 442 (which isn't 442). The kids' teams for instance, could pick an 11 which would be balanced perfectly in any formation, wingers, 5 in the mid, 433, 3 at the back.

The first team is unbalanced no matter what team we put out. A great 451 team for example, would not include all 3 of Silva, Nasri & Yaya. It would probably have just one of them. An ideal 433 would not have Silva & Nasri alongside Aguero, but neither would it have Dzeko, Bony or Jovetic. A 442 would not have Silva Nasri & Yaya.

We have quality players, but not the ideal blend to do what we want.

[Slim]

If we did that, imagine if we had to change the formation ?

Just for the record, I'm absolutely not against changing formations or a particular fan of 4222 I'm just against utter fucking bullshit. And people claiming you 'can't' play this system & that system v Barca or whoever, are talking out of their fucking arseholes, & people who claim 451 will definitely work & therefore they are tactically superior to the manager, every time he doesn't use it, are also talking out of their fucking arseholes. It works sometimes & doesn't work others, just like our other formations, of which there have been many.

I think a problem we have is that our best players together don't aparticularly suit ANY formation. And the only one any combo of strikers suits, is so called 442 (which isn't 442). The kids' teams for instance, could pick an 11 which would be balanced perfectly in any formation, wingers, 5 in the mid, 433, 3 at the back.

The first team is unbalanced no matter what team we put out. A great 451 team for example, would not include all 3 of Silva, Nasri & Yaya. It would probably have just one of them. An ideal 433 would not have Silva & Nasri alongside Aguero, but neither would it have Dzeko, Bony or Jovetic. A 442 would not have Silva Nasri & Yaya.

We have quality players, but not the ideal blend to do what we want.

I think this is why Pellers needs to make a seismic shift in the squad. And while that isn't a possibility he needs to start picking the best team that fits his system instead of picking the 11 best players and hoping they click on the day.

[Ted Hughes]

I think he's tried that really though, with the likes of Navas & Milner. I think our best team was the one with no strikers in it. The extra two in midfield made up for the failings of Yaya, Silva & Nasri & enabled the whole team to press in the opponents' half. With Milner dragging players all over the shop & pressing like fuck & the defence almost playing as midfield.

We still fucked up eventually though.

[Wonderwall]

I think he's tried that really though, with the likes of Navas & Milner. I think our best team was the one with no strikers in it. The extra two in midfield made up for the failings of Yaya, Silva & Nasri & enabled the whole team to press in the opponents' half. With Milner dragging players all over the shop & pressing like fuck & the defence almost playing as midfield.

We still fucked up eventually though.

I dont think we did, we only fucked up when Aguero returned to the team after injury, we never lost with the false 9!

[Bluedj]

I think he's tried that really though, with the likes of Navas & Milner. I think our best team was the one with no strikers in it. The extra two in midfield made up for the failings of Yaya, Silva & Nasri & enabled the whole team to press in the opponents' half. With Milner dragging players all over the shop & pressing like fuck & the defence almost playing as midfield.

We still fucked up eventually though.

I dont think we did, we only fucked up when Aguero returned to the team after injury, we never lost with the false 9!

I agree with both Ted & Wonderwall rgarding the false 9. Aguero has been poor since his return from his last injury, before it, he was redhot........My mind is boggled :-S

[Ted Hughes]

We blew it v Burnley with that system though surely ?

[Hazy2]

We blew it v Burnley with that system though surely ?

Spot on.

I do think Pellers knows what he wants on the pitch and in certain games, the players are IMHO point blank refusing to do it.
He has tried every player in that squad, for me there is a poison in that dressing room.

Sadly our failings might just see us walloped big time tomorrow night, Our setup & formations are always accommodating some cunt in that squad, I even wonder now have the likes of Fernando been abused by certain lazy twats as they know the blame will be placed right on his and others heads. Mancini was right about some the squad wether we like it or not we should have been cautious of what we wished for, as players are not gonna get sacked, they are however sussed out as piss poor when the application is needed to retain a trophy, I sound like a right bitter twat, but to not go to Barca coz I am pissed off with em sums it up.

[Im_Spartacus]

I happen to think the players cannot be allowed to go under the radar this time. The silence from the captain I feel say's something. Mancini was a dead man walking, snippets from the same rag journo 's had us convinced the poor players were scared for their lives under such a tyrant

The 'rag journos' were right. As I've repeated many times both during and since those events from an impeccable source inside the club, Mancini was a lunatic and there were several players who had been subject to behaviour that has no place in any organization regardless of their 'crimes' in his eyes. The physical violence towards Balotelli for example, being the only example which came to public attention was far from the only incident.

He had to go for his behaviour in the end, as the players were far more valuable a commodity to the club than he was, and that's what it boils down to when deciding to replace a manager. However the subplot to that story which is now repeating itself, of players downing tools does, as you rightly point out, show a clearer pattern of behaviour amongst elements of the squad, and for me suggests that regardless of Mancini's behaviour, there is a bloc of players that has too much power within the club, and it will be interesting to see how the Spafia react to this this time around......as I reckon if they are switched on, they will back the manager and bin some big names, making a big signal that the player power era at the club is over.

That's what needs to happen, and I will be disappointed if the club reacts in any other way.

[Mase]

"physical violence towards Balotelli"

Bloody ell mate he dragged him by his top. Hardly call it physical violence for crying out loud. As a manager he shouldn't do it. Probably as much as Sir Alice shouldn't have kicked/thrown a boot at Beckham. It happens.

[Im_Spartacus]

Sign Pogba and Reus, that's imperitive. We should be spending whatever it takes - £100m if we have to - to sign them. We have the money and we have the players available to sell. Personally I'd be shipping Dzeko, Silva, Kolarov and Jovetic. That's enough to recoup a lot of the money spent, but the squad barely loses anything. We'd then have a lot more flexibility, we'd have a blend of youth and experience, pace and possession, directness and comfort. Would obviously like more squad players to replace the outgoing players but I won't go into specifics.

you have just got rid of 2 strikers, a left back and our most creative ever player and signed 2 midfielders?

I like Pogba and Reus and would love us to sign them, but get rid of Silva? Really?

Yes, I think it's imperative we sell Silva. We can't keep on cobbling a team together around his and Toure's defensive deficiencies. The sheer number of positions silva takes up in the course of a season shows that whilst he may be the first name on the team sheet, he is being squeezed in at the expense of something else......on the wing, he costs us cover for a fullback, in the centre and we need one or two babysitters.

If we played him further forward, I'd keep him, but both Mancini and Pellegrini seem loathe to do so - strange, as that was his position when he was at Valencia along with Mata.

[Im_Spartacus]

"physical violence towards Balotelli"

Bloody ell mate he dragged him by his top. Hardly call it physical violence for crying out loud. As a manager he shouldn't do it. Probably as much as Sir Alice shouldn't have kicked/thrown a boot at Beckham. It happens.

And if that happened in your workplace?

Like I said, it wasn't the only incident, it was just the only one reported. One player in particular was consistently harassed and bullied and eventually came to full blows after training at Carrington when Mancini chased him out of the dressing room and started pushing and shoving. Probably handbags in reality, but not behaviour that can be condoned from a manager in any position of authority in any organization - football doesn't excuse him.

[Mase]

"physical violence towards Balotelli"

Bloody ell mate he dragged him by his top. Hardly call it physical violence for crying out loud. As a manager he shouldn't do it. Probably as much as Sir Alice shouldn't have kicked/thrown a boot at Beckham. It happens.

And if that happened in your workplace?

Like I said, it wasn't the only incident, it was just the only one reported

Ahh the old "if that happened in your workplace" argument. The fact is football is completely different and separate from any normal work place in the world! It's been proven time and time again. If I failed a drugs test where I worked I would get fired. I wouldn't just get a couple of months ban from work.
If it came out at work that I'd had a threesome with a couple of hookers in my own private time I'm sure no one would be bothered. But if I football does it its all over the papers.

You can't compare 'normal' jobs to football.

[Im_Spartacus]

"physical violence towards Balotelli"

Bloody ell mate he dragged him by his top. Hardly call it physical violence for crying out loud. As a manager he shouldn't do it. Probably as much as Sir Alice shouldn't have kicked/thrown a boot at Beckham. It happens.

And if that happened in your workplace?

Like I said, it wasn't the only incident, it was just the only one reported

Ahh the old "if that happened in your workplace" argument. The fact is football is completely different and separate from any normal work place in the world! It's been proven time and time again. If I failed a drugs test where I worked I would get fired. I wouldn't just get a couple of months ban from work.
If it came out at work that I'd had a threesome with a couple of hookers in my own private time I'm sure no one would be bothered. But if I football does it its all over the papers.

You can't compare 'normal' jobs to football.

But just like the pattern of behaviour of players who appear to be downing tools under successive managers, Mancini displayed a pattern of behaviour towards everyone at the club which was frankly weird.

He got away with it for as long as he brought success (hence I agree to an extent with your argument about football being different), but the minute his methods stopped bringing success, his political capital in the eyes of the Spafia was practically zero and that pattern of behaviour could no longer be tolerated.

This is why I hope it's different with Pellegrini, and that the club support him over the players this time round. He's not (as far as we know) alienated everyone in the club with weird and aggressive behaviour, but by all accounts is a decent guy who has shown he knows how to win. They don't have the excuse that they had with Mancini, and that alone should raise enough questions with the Spafia about the role of the players in our current predicament.

Pellegrini says as much in the recent Guardian interview, where he stated that Mancini was not sacked for a failure of results, but because of other issues. If the Spafia believe he's going about it the right way, it would seem an odd decision to sack him.

[Ted Hughes]

Mancini was a nutter who also wanted total control of the club, like Ferguson. City don't want the club to be dependant on the manager, so he's gone.

I think one of our big players may go next season but I don't think it will be Silva.

[Im_Spartacus]

Mancini was a nutter who also wanted total control of the club, like Ferguson. City don't want the club to be dependant on the manager, so he's gone.

I think one of our big players may go next season but I don't think it will be Silva.

I agree, I hope we can find a way to fit him in, and think neither the club nor manager have the bollocks to piss the fans off by moving him on.

It would be interesting though to see whether Real would be prepared to talk about a swap deal for Isco. Signing Silva would be a big signing for them, whereas Pellegrini clearly thinks a lot of Isco and he is showing signs of delivering now at Real.

It's hard to put a value on either player, but I think this sort of deal could be beneficial for both clubs