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Fans need to realise that the game at City has changed over the last two seasons. The way opposing managers and players looked at us has changed beyond recognition.

The Past.

City are shite. if you work hard and keep it tight for twenty or thirty minutes, you can shut the crowd up and then pick them off once the crowd turn on their own. They have no players of any real talent. They are hard-working enough but ultimately a soft touch. Any game at City is potentially a piece of piss. Any team can go there and win.

Now.

City have got two or three players that might just get into a World XI. If you go there, you need to defend properly, preferably in numbers, and deny their creative players any space at all to work in. If they get space, they score. They don't make a lot of chances but the ones they do make they generally put away. In short they are a highly efficient outfit. This means that you MUST NOT make mistakes. If by chance you do make one, we need to have plenty of cover to hope to retrieve the situation. Therefore I want to see all of you focussing on defence. Counter attack quickly if you get the chance, but this is going to be hard as their defensive five don't get forward a great deal. A draw is probably the best we can get here, though the fickleness of their fans is starting to become an issue again as they may start to get on the backs of their players if the conditions are right. This may be our best chance but it is only possible if we keep their top players under control.

Now this clearly has repercussions for fans.

Anyone going expecting to see 11-goal thrillers is going to be disappointed. Key point coming up. This is not always City's fault.

The opposition come to stifle us. It is a compliment. It means they are scared of us because we are good. It results in porr games mopst of the time. This does not mean we are shite, or that our players are shite, or that our manager is shite. It means the oppostion are scared and know that they need to be at their very, very best defensively to get anything other than a defeat. You might not like me saying this, but we are now in the position that liverpool were in thirty years ago or that united were in ten years ago. Poor matches are not totally City's fault. Sometimes the other team play well. This is the nature of sport. Think how many shit matches the crowds at the fleapit or Anfield have had to sit through becasue the opposition have no other ambition than to just stifle the home team. Did they moan like fuck about it? No they didn't. They backed their team like fans are supposed to do. They don't go around wanting to sack their manager simply because they've a had a couple of fucking goalless draws.

What fans need to do is understand this and still get behind the team. Despite all the high salaries and the money being spent and the lack of players that we can identify with, the role of the fan has changed in only one respect - we now need a bit more patience than we had before. Other than that our job is no different. We still need to go to the games and make some fucking noise. Make the place intimidating like it used to be on derby day when we were shit.

Right.

Anyone who goes to the game not prepared to sing themselves hoarse for the cause can fuck off to the Opera House.

Anyone who thinks we have got a divine right to play free-flowing football and win 12-0 every fucking week is a gibbering idiot who fails to grasp the reality of today's professional game.

Anyone who wants to sack the manager when the club is in its current position, a league place higher than we have finished for the last 33 years and joint top of our group in Europe, is a fucking cretin who has shown that they are thick enough to believe what they read in the media.

Best fans in the world? God's own club? Fucking bollocks. Sort your fucking selves out and start behaving like proper football fans instead of spoilt fucking babies.

Well I understand what you are trying to do, this would be more of an argument for a Chelsea fan after their recent results. We just don't get 11 goal thrillers because we play far too defensively.

This sounds to me like the perfect argument to make after people were calling for Hughes' head after all his draws last season.

Top post Tokyo, I suspect that you will have your bollox chewed by a few on here. I shall let this deveop before chuckin my two penneth in.

I will leave you with a thought...a twist on a quote by Pres J F Kennedy (I think)

"ASK NOT WHAT MY FOOTBALL CLUB CAN DO FOR ME BUT WHAT CAN I DO FOR MY FOOTBALL CLUB"

It's gratifying that Scum and Chelsea were absolutely dire this weekend, and Arsenal scraped through because Everton cant finish. Because it brings back into perspective the fact that we had 60% possession and 24 goal attempts. A different kind of 'bad' eh?

One wonders if we had delivered exactly the same performance but 3 goals had gone in, whether all the threads would be about us winning the league?

I'm sure they would. Fickle is the modern fan.

john@staustell wrote:It's gratifying that Scum and Chelsea were absolutely dire this weekend, and Arsenal scraped through because Everton cant finish. Because it brings back into perspective the fact that we had 60% possession and 24 goal attempts. A different kind of 'bad' eh?

One wonders if we had delivered exactly the same performance but[b] 3 goals had gone in[/b], whether all the threads would be about us winning the league?

I'm sure they would. Fickle is the modern fan.

Yeah but they didn't. So it's a pointless thing to bring up.

Can I just ask for a 1-0 bore fest, maybe 2 at Christmas?

Just another patronising post aimed at quelling those fans who may have something to say about our current form and game play. I'm sure every one of those supporters at the ground understands the same as you do, the thing is, they seem to be having serious reservations. Why is that?

And as you say, if those who won't sing whoarse for the cause can fuck off to the Opera, then who the fuck would be in the ground, because I could hear a fucking pin drop on Saturday!

That's it mate, blame those in the ground, why not! What the fuck have they brought to the Party???

john@staustell wrote:It's gratifying that Scum and Chelsea were absolutely dire this weekend, and Arsenal scraped through because Everton cant finish. Because it brings back into perspective the fact that we had 60% possession and 24 goal attempts. A different kind of 'bad' eh?

One wonders if we had delivered exactly the same performance but 3 goals had gone in, whether all the threads would be about us winning the league?

I'm sure they would. Fickle is the modern fan.

Some fans maybe but some of us have been saying we've been a bit fortunate in the earlier games & don't always see a win or loss as evidence of a good/bad performance. People have asked me why I've been negative recently after some wins or draws & it's because sometimes I think we've been relatively shit.

Imo this is the place where fans should give Bob & the team a good kicking if they don't perform though, not in the ground. People shouting "this is shit" & storming out with 10 mins to go, are wankers. THERE'S TEN MINUTES TO GO FOR FUCKS SAKE, SUPPORT THE FUCKING TEAM! Bob will have to play his part & get the team to play entertaining football though. Some people in cyberland may accept dull football but it won't wash long term at City. Even if we win stuff, as soon as it goes wrong, the crowd will kick off. It's the way it's always been. Kendall was never really accepted for example even though he was building a top 5 team whilst Brian Horton was accepted, even though he couldn't organise a pissup in a brewery defensively. Ferguson had the same discontent at OT when he played defensively in the early days. It's against rag's tradition & it's against ours. The fans kick off.

Tokyo Blue wrote:Fans need to realise that the game at City has changed over the last two seasons. The way opposing managers and players looked at us has changed beyond recognition.

The Past.

City are shite. if you work hard and keep it tight for twenty or thirty minutes, you can shut the crowd up and then pick them off once the crowd turn on their own. They have no players of any real talent. They are hard-working enough but ultimately a soft touch. Any game at City is potentially a piece of piss. Any team can go there and win.

Now.

City have got two or three players that might just get into a World XI. If you go there, you need to defend properly, preferably in numbers, and deny their creative players any space at all to work in. If they get space, they score. They don't make a lot of chances but the ones they do make they generally put away. In short they are a highly efficient outfit. This means that you MUST NOT make mistakes. If by chance you do make one, we need to have plenty of cover to hope to retrieve the situation. Therefore I want to see all of you focussing on defence. Counter attack quickly if you get the chance, but this is going to be hard as their defensive five don't get forward a great deal. A draw is probably the best we can get here, though the fickleness of their fans is starting to become an issue again as they may start to get on the backs of their players if the conditions are right. This may be our best chance but it is only possible if we keep their top players under control.

Now this clearly has repercussions for fans.

Anyone going expecting to see 11-goal thrillers is going to be disappointed. Key point coming up. This is not always City's fault.

The opposition come to stifle us. It is a compliment. It means they are scared of us because we are good. It results in porr games mopst of the time. This does not mean we are shite, or that our players are shite, or that our manager is shite. It means the oppostion are scared and know that they need to be at their very, very best defensively to get anything other than a defeat. You might not like me saying this, but we are now in the position that liverpool were in thirty years ago or that united were in ten years ago. Poor matches are not totally City's fault. Sometimes the other team play well. This is the nature of sport. Think how many shit matches the crowds at the fleapit or Anfield have had to sit through becasue the opposition have no other ambition than to just stifle the home team. Did they moan like fuck about it? No they didn't. They backed their team like fans are supposed to do. They don't go around wanting to sack their manager simply because they've a had a couple of fucking goalless draws.

What fans need to do is understand this and still get behind the team. Despite all the high salaries and the money being spent and the lack of players that we can identify with, the role of the fan has changed in only one respect - we now need a bit more patience than we had before. Other than that our job is no different. We still need to go to the games and make some fucking noise. Make the place intimidating like it used to be on derby day when we were shit.

Right.

Anyone who goes to the game not prepared to sing themselves hoarse for the cause can fuck off to the Opera House.

Anyone who thinks we have got a divine right to play free-flowing football and win 12-0 every fucking week is a gibbering idiot who fails to grasp the reality of today's professional game.

Anyone who wants to sack the manager when the club is in its current position, a league place higher than we have finished for the last 33 years and joint top of our group in Europe, is a fucking cretin who has shown that they are thick enough to believe what they read in the media.

Best fans in the world? God's own club? Fucking bollocks. Sort your fucking selves out and start behaving like proper football fans instead of spoilt fucking babies.

Your whole post is just a condescending load of tripe. And the part I've highlighted especially so.
You think teams go to Chelsea or the swamp with expectations any different?

As I've said somewhere else - 15 goals in 13 games, 7 from 7 at home, and this from the most expensively assembled squad in history.

So the next stage is fuck me we cant win here ! they score loads of goals......cant wait.

Far too sensible, expect a kicking.

A few points:

1) Whilst the game today was frustrating, and the first-half especially bloodless Bobby played his most effective attackers. Enough chances were created for us to run out comfortable winners. It didn't happen, so we have to live with the result.
How about giving some credit to Brum. They organised themselves well and defended resolutely. Why didn't they play an open expansive game? Because they feared they would get battered.
I always got the feeling that last year teams would come and be convinced that they'd be able to get a goal or two - and they did on too many occasions. The games were much more entertaining, but that was based on our perceived weaknesses. This year the games are more boring because we are perceived to be stronger.

2) Why have we so few attacking options? Surely we could have bought more in summer?
Have a look at todays bollox. Dani Alves would prefer to go to Chelsea than us despite the fact that we would pat him more. Surely the Kaka saga should show us that we can't just flash the cash and expect the world's best to come flocking to our doors.
I believe that players like Alves prefer Chelsea for two reasons. First, they are established so players are confident that they'll be playing at the highest level, we can't offer that yet. Second, Chelsea are stable. Despite the many changes of management, players believe that the show will continue to roll on, more or less, the same way. We haven't proved ourselves on that score yet (and that's not a suggestion to have five managers a year just to prove a point).
We need to establish ourselves as a solid top 4 side, and regular CL participants to be an attractive destination - money or no money.
Also we need to establish ourselves as a stable club. Players won't want to go to a place where everything gets thrown into the melting pot at the first sign of trouble. The best will want to go to a club where everyone holds their nerve.

3) Someone suggested on another topic that Sunderland beat Chelsea because Bruce is a better manager than Bobby. So what happened the last time we played Chelsea at their place? "Ah well," I can hear some say, "they were special circumstances." What were the special cicumstances at COMS earlier in the year? It seems to me that Bobby gets little credit when things go well and all the blame when they don't.

4) Some on here are calling for Bobby to be sacked now, despite our position, saying that the league position didn't protect Hughes last year. This may be true, and I certainly don't want to go into the rights and wrongs of it. Rather I would ask another question. What top class manager (ones with plenty of choices) would want to come to club that won't back him if things get sticky - and they do for everyone?

People have a right to say what they want. If you want to cricise, then fine. But can we tone down the more extreme stuff and show a bit of backbone.

I'm not trying to play the game of who's the most loyal blue - not me, there are others who have spent a lot more time and money following City than I have. But, it's about 12 years since I and about 2000 others trooped off to Maine Road on a freezing night to watch us get beat 1-2 by Mansfield in the LVD Vans trophy or whatever.
I was well brassed off, but, still confident that, even with the management we had then, we would eventually get back to the top table.

I had confidence then, and I am confident now.

No, its a media conspiracy. You already informed us all of that earlier.

Spoilt brats blah blah blah. The whole fucking world can see we play dire football. That's the BIG problem. If you like it, fine, but I don't see the need for berating those who don't.

john68 wrote:Top post Tokyo, I suspect that you will have your bollox chewed by a few on here. I shall let this deveop before chuckin my two penneth in.

I will leave you with a thought...a twist on a quote by Pres J F Kennedy (I think)

"ASK NOT WHAT MY FOOTBALL CLUB CAN DO FOR ME BUT WHAT CAN I DO FOR MY FOOTBALL CLUB"

Love the quote - I have been worried that all the concerns that we have been told to have about (in the future) attracting fans with less depth in their care for CITY has come about a bit early

Reading that back it sounds like I am saying they do not support - not the intention - more a questionof ffs lads show some patience and get behind the team - the team needs strong support - in the past I have criticised the atmosphere at COMS - but it was better than booing - and smiilar thoughts about the 'volume' on here

people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Original Dub wrote:

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Yet 4th is exactly where we are Dub

Can I ask?

If Bobby plays the tactical game for the rest of the season and we finish exactly where we want to be in 4th spot

Will you be so critical?

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Yet 4th is exactly where we are Dub

Can I ask?

If Bobby plays the tactical game for the rest of the season and we finish exactly where we want to be in 4th spot

Will you be so critical?

I'll be happy we finish fourth, but also happy the season is over. I might just check the classifieds from now on though, because the result is all that matters ;-)

I don't like the way we play for the most part mate and that's my problem. However, I can live with it when I think it will lead us to glory. I just don't think it will lead us to glory.

Trajectory and all that.

Original Dub wrote:

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Yet 4th is exactly where we are Dub

Can I ask?

If Bobby plays the tactical game for the rest of the season and we finish exactly where we want to be in 4th spot

Will you be so critical?

I'll be happy we finish fourth, but also happy the season is over. I might just check the classifieds from now on though, because the result is all that matters ;-)

I don't like the way we play for the most part mate and that's my problem. However, I can live with it when I think it will lead us to glory. I just don't think it will lead us to glory.

Trajectory and all that.

That's why I think it's a little premature to be jumping on his back

I don't think ANYONE likes the way we are playing at the moment...but I for one am quite willing to wait until the end of the season to see if he can deliver the good that the Sheikh desires...if not...I doubt he will be here to start next season anyway...so I don't understand why everyone is getting their knickers in a twist

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Yet 4th is exactly where we are Dub

Can I ask?

If Bobby plays the tactical game for the rest of the season and we finish exactly where we want to be in 4th spot

Will you be so critical?

I'll be happy we finish fourth, but also happy the season is over. I might just check the classifieds from now on though, because the result is all that matters ;-)

I don't like the way we play for the most part mate and that's my problem. However, I can live with it when I think it will lead us to glory. I just don't think it will lead us to glory.

Trajectory and all that.

That's why I think it's a little premature to be jumping on his back

I don't think ANYONE likes the way we are playing at the moment...but I for one am quite willing to wait until the end of the season to see if he can deliver the good that the Sheikh desires...if not...I doubt he will be here to start next season anyway...so I don't understand why everyone is getting their knickers in a twist

No knickers being twisted here mate. I don't want him gone now either. I just have my concerns as to whether he will change. I also have concerns whether we'll achieve fourth if we continue with such a lack of ambition.

So I said I'd share with the rest of the class.

Since then I've had about ten people tell me its ridiculous to want him gone now.

Strange.

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

colonel_muck wrote:people can look at it however they want. but i know what i like to see from a football match, especially when i've paid to see it. and city this season (except against liverpool when we were class) has not been it. how come i don't get bored watching chelsea, spurs even united? do teams not 'defend properly' against them?

Its a myth that we HAVE to play like this to get fourth. Absolute horse shit.

Yet 4th is exactly where we are Dub

Can I ask?

If Bobby plays the tactical game for the rest of the season and we finish exactly where we want to be in 4th spot

Will you be so critical?

i'll tell you for one that i will be. whats the point in getting to the champions league with that mentality? so we can be bored twice a week and even more people can notice it? sounds great. get mancini out.