***Official England v Algeria Thread***

[Im_Spartacus]

I disagree mate, and I rate a couple of our players above him. Yes, he is good for a a team who have a great (and I mean that) club manager, but he is not in the same league as the rest of the top players; fuck potentially, he is not that player. And what really winds me up is that he has no allegiance to our country, failing to sing the National Anthem, regardless of choice.

Honestly mate, if we are relying on him to take us anywhere then I'll give up now, just like Lennon, they have no pride whatsoever. They are a law unto themselves and won't help us prove our worth, which has been shown (sad face there mate).

Could you name the English Players you rate above Rooney to play in that position? I wouldn't be starting with Heskey btw.

And Capello was once one of the very finest Managers in the World. I've no doubt about it. The professionalism he installed in England from day one was evident - but it's fallen apart as soon as the World Cup arrived. Look at how easy qualification was.

I'm still optimistic that things will click in time for the Slovenia Match but I'll be leading the riots if England finish 3rd in the Group. Well, I won't be rioting but you know what I mean.

Cheers for the reply Jim, only just spotted it. And the answer to your question (without looking down my nose at you) is that I actually rate a few higher than Rooney in that position because I just don't see him as an out-and-out striker. For me he is a second striker, someone who sits off the front man, picks up the bits and pieces and allows the front man to do his business. In my opinion, that's the problem with our current set-up, we're using Heskey in the second striker role which should be where Rooney is and if you are playing a 2nd striker to feed a 2nd striker then there's going to be problems, if you know what I mean.

For me, I'd put Bent, Defoe and even Peter Crouch above him in the front man role as I actually see the likes of Defoe and Bent as out-and-out strikers, with Crouch somewhere inbetween. The problem is that no manager has the balls to drop him from the 1st team or seemingly now, not even able to play him off a front man. Don't get me wrong, Rooney is a quality player but I just wonder if he'd be that 1st name on the team sheet if he wasn't at U***d but still at Everton? At U***d, Taggart has renewed his faith in him due to the sale of Tranny but if you look past this season, is Rooney really the star performer that we are led to believe he is? Yes, he runs around a lot, yes he scores some goals, but if you consider that last season he scored less Premier goals than our very own Robinho, and only the same amount as Bent, who had limited appearances and finished 7 places lower than the Champions, then it does get you thinking. The season before that he scored about the same as Defoe and the season before that only scored 1 more goal than Bent, who was playing for fucking Charlton.

I was checking up on some stats prior to the WC starting and was amazed to find that Rooney's success rate was 1 goal in nearly 2 games (about 170 minutes), whereas Crouch who has not been a regular starter had a success rate of a goal a game (about 95 mins), even Defoe was a goal in 125 minutes. I checked on Bent but there wasn't much as you'd well guess, but when you look at his record for Sunderland this year, a team that finished 13th in the league, 24 goals is no mean feat by any standards.

So Jim, hopefully I've give you a valid answer, without starting with Heskey! Rooney may be your cup of tea for leading the attack, but for me he should play off the front man, as Heskey does with him.

v. good post there mate. Agree 100% about the 2x 2nd striker issue. Rooney is not the man to hang our hat on for England, but i'd love to see him play behind bent/defoe.

The sad truth is though, our forward line is not world class whoever fills those spots, which increases the pressure on Gerrard & Lampard to up their contribution in the goals and creativity department, as a result when Rooney plays with Heskey, we almost have our best 3 players overwhelmed by the extra creative and goalscoring responsibility/workload they have to take on

[Dameerto]

In a few years if we end up with a team of new players that doesn't carry such a heavy burden of expectation, and if the manager shields them from the media wanting sound bites on a daily basis, we might just end up with a tournament performance to smile about.

[Beefymcfc]

v. good post there mate. Agree 100% about the 2x 2nd striker issue. Rooney is not the man to hang our hat on for England, but i'd love to see him play behind bent/defoe.

The sad truth is though, our forward line is not world class whoever fills those spots, which increases the pressure on Gerrard & Lampard to up their contribution in the goals and creativity department, as a result when Rooney plays with Heskey, we almost have our best 3 players overwhelmed by the extra creative and goalscoring responsibility/workload they have to take on

Cheers pal, it is a conundrum isn't it, but hopefully one that will be addressed by Fabio, because if things stay the same, we won't be going any further in this competition. People may well be thinking that we will walk all over Slovenia, but in reality we were supposed to do that to our last 2 opponents. Who says we are going get an easy ride from a nation that are currently in the driving seat and who only need a draw to go through!?!

[btajim]

Could you name the English Players you rate above Rooney to play in that position? I wouldn't be starting with Heskey btw.

And Capello was once one of the very finest Managers in the World. I've no doubt about it. The professionalism he installed in England from day one was evident - but it's fallen apart as soon as the World Cup arrived. Look at how easy qualification was.

I'm still optimistic that things will click in time for the Slovenia Match but I'll be leading the riots if England finish 3rd in the Group. Well, I won't be rioting but you know what I mean.

Cheers for the reply Jim, only just spotted it. And the answer to your question (without looking down my nose at you) is that I actually rate a few higher than Rooney in that position because I just don't see him as an out-and-out striker. For me he is a second striker, someone who sits off the front man, picks up the bits and pieces and allows the front man to do his business. In my opinion, that's the problem with our current set-up, we're using Heskey in the second striker role which should be where Rooney is and if you are playing a 2nd striker to feed a 2nd striker then there's going to be problems, if you know what I mean.

For me, I'd put Bent, Defoe and even Peter Crouch above him in the front man role as I actually see the likes of Defoe and Bent as out-and-out strikers, with Crouch somewhere inbetween. The problem is that no manager has the balls to drop him from the 1st team or seemingly now, not even able to play him off a front man. Don't get me wrong, Rooney is a quality player but I just wonder if he'd be that 1st name on the team sheet if he wasn't at U***d but still at Everton? At U***d, Taggart has renewed his faith in him due to the sale of Tranny but if you look past this season, is Rooney really the star performer that we are led to believe he is? Yes, he runs around a lot, yes he scores some goals, but if you consider that last season he scored less Premier goals than our very own Robinho, and only the same amount as Bent, who had limited appearances and finished 7 places lower than the Champions, then it does get you thinking. The season before that he scored about the same as Defoe and the season before that only scored 1 more goal than Bent, who was playing for fucking Charlton.

I was checking up on some stats prior to the WC starting and was amazed to find that Rooney's success rate was 1 goal in nearly 2 games (about 170 minutes), whereas Crouch who has not been a regular starter had a success rate of a goal a game (about 95 mins), even Defoe was a goal in 125 minutes. I checked on Bent but there wasn't much as you'd well guess, but when you look at his record for Sunderland this year, a team that finished 13th in the league, 24 goals is no mean feat by any standards.

So Jim, hopefully I've give you a valid answer, without starting with Heskey! Rooney may be your cup of tea for leading the attack, but for me he should play off the front man, as Heskey does with him.

Without looking down your nose at me? Pardon? Are you trying to get my back up? Apologies if my response makes you feel small, awkward, inferior or stupid. I doubt it will - but if you want to tread on egg shells then I will too.

You're happy to remain with Heskey as the Big Man up front with Rooney just off him despite them presently creating no Goals between them so far? I want to know who you'd play with or instead of Rooney and you don't actually give me an answer. You just explain where he plays in your England Team. With Defoe? Crouch?

Rooney had a spectacular seasons with the RAGs in 09/10 and his form warrants a regular starting place for England. If anything, his disappointing display last night is highlighted because of the previous heights he's reached. Rooney just needs to be utilised correctly because he does not lack ability to do the job. How about Rooney up front on his own and 5 men behind him? I've given an example Team in the thread I've started for the Slovenia Match.

[King Kev]

[Beefymcfc]

Could you name the English Players you rate above Rooney to play in that position? I wouldn't be starting with Heskey btw.

And Capello was once one of the very finest Managers in the World. I've no doubt about it. The professionalism he installed in England from day one was evident - but it's fallen apart as soon as the World Cup arrived. Look at how easy qualification was.

I'm still optimistic that things will click in time for the Slovenia Match but I'll be leading the riots if England finish 3rd in the Group. Well, I won't be rioting but you know what I mean.

Cheers for the reply Jim, only just spotted it. And the answer to your question (without looking down my nose at you) is that I actually rate a few higher than Rooney in that position because I just don't see him as an out-and-out striker. For me he is a second striker, someone who sits off the front man, picks up the bits and pieces and allows the front man to do his business. In my opinion, that's the problem with our current set-up, we're using Heskey in the second striker role which should be where Rooney is and if you are playing a 2nd striker to feed a 2nd striker then there's going to be problems, if you know what I mean.

For me, I'd put Bent, Defoe and even Peter Crouch above him in the front man role as I actually see the likes of Defoe and Bent as out-and-out strikers, with Crouch somewhere inbetween. The problem is that no manager has the balls to drop him from the 1st team or seemingly now, not even able to play him off a front man. Don't get me wrong, Rooney is a quality player but I just wonder if he'd be that 1st name on the team sheet if he wasn't at U***d but still at Everton? At U***d, Taggart has renewed his faith in him due to the sale of Tranny but if you look past this season, is Rooney really the star performer that we are led to believe he is? Yes, he runs around a lot, yes he scores some goals, but if you consider that last season he scored less Premier goals than our very own Robinho, and only the same amount as Bent, who had limited appearances and finished 7 places lower than the Champions, then it does get you thinking. The season before that he scored about the same as Defoe and the season before that only scored 1 more goal than Bent, who was playing for fucking Charlton.

I was checking up on some stats prior to the WC starting and was amazed to find that Rooney's success rate was 1 goal in nearly 2 games (about 170 minutes), whereas Crouch who has not been a regular starter had a success rate of a goal a game (about 95 mins), even Defoe was a goal in 125 minutes. I checked on Bent but there wasn't much as you'd well guess, but when you look at his record for Sunderland this year, a team that finished 13th in the league, 24 goals is no mean feat by any standards.

So Jim, hopefully I've give you a valid answer, without starting with Heskey! Rooney may be your cup of tea for leading the attack, but for me he should play off the front man, as Heskey does with him.

Without looking down your nose at me? Pardon? Are you trying to get my back up? Apologies if my response makes you feel small, awkward, inferior or stupid. I doubt it will - but if you want to tread on egg shells then I will too.

You're happy to remain with Heskey as the Big Man up front with Rooney just off him despite them presently creating no Goals between them so far? I want to know who you'd play with or instead of Rooney and you don't actually give me an answer. You just explain where he plays in your England Team. With Defoe? Crouch?

Rooney had a spectacular seasons with the RAGs in 09/10 and his form warrants a regular starting place for England. If anything, his disappointing display last night is highlighted because of the previous heights he's reached. Rooney just needs to be utilised correctly because he does not lack ability to do the job. How about Rooney up front on his own and 5 men behind him? I've given an example Team in the thread I've started for the Slovenia Match.

Did you actually read my post? In no way do I feel belittled, even though the highlighted line was a way of trying. You then go on to suggest that I want to play Rooney behind Heskey, where did I say this Jim; in fact, where do I actually mention Heskey apart from the last line?

If you read it, what you'll find is that I believe Rooney should be played in the Heskey role, Heskey should be shot and that we should have one of the others as the front man, but I'm sure you already know that mate don't you?

Oh, and here's your Egg Shells Back, you'll know what to do wih them!

Stay Frosty!

[btajim]

If you read it, what you'll find is that I believe Rooney should be played in the Heskey role, Heskey should be shot and that we should have one of the others as the front man, but I'm sure you already know that mate don't you?

Heskey and Rooney haven't scored a Goal between themselves in 2 Matches against mediocre opposition and you want to stick with them whilst playing the more succesful side in the Group? Great...

Bring back Corradi to replace Tevez.

[Beefymcfc]

If you read it, what you'll find is that I believe Rooney should be played in the Heskey role, Heskey should be shot and that we should have one of the others as the front man, but I'm sure you already know that mate don't you?

Heskey and Rooney haven't scored a Goal between themselves in 2 Matches against mediocre opposition and you want to stick with them whilst playing the more succesful side in the Group? Great...

Bring back Corradi to replace Tevez.

Ha ha ha, now your just making yourself look foolish!

As I said, Stay Frosty Big Man.

[ross.mcfc]

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

Got to feel sorry for English. Couple of shit games and Krauts, Yanks, Jocks and Chicken men all gather to have pop.

I think I'll be cheering for England for the rest of the competition just to keep it balanced.

[btajim]

Heskey and Rooney haven't scored a Goal between themselves in 2 Matches against mediocre opposition and you want to stick with them whilst playing the more succesful side in the Group? Great...

Bring back Corradi to replace Tevez.

Ha ha ha, now your just making yourself look foolish!

As I said, Stay Frosty Big Man.

I'm sorry? Which part? The bit where I relay a fact or the obvious joke?

"Big Man"? Quite...

[Ted Hughes]

Well it's fucking true isn't it? If we'd played like that against decent teams we'd be out of the competition.

(What sort of sad fuck keeps a jpeg of the back page of 'The Sun' from God knows when? Hahahah Jesus!. Wherever that's come from, the owner is one sad bastard!)

[Beefymcfc]

Heskey and Rooney haven't scored a Goal between themselves in 2 Matches against mediocre opposition and you want to stick with them whilst playing the more succesful side in the Group? Great...

Bring back Corradi to replace Tevez.

Ha ha ha, now your just making yourself look foolish!

As I said, Stay Frosty Big Man.

I'm sorry? Which part? The bit where I relay a fact or the obvious joke?

"Big Man"? Quite...

But Jim, you are clearly stating the FACT that I somehow wish to persevere with our current forward line-up when it definately isn't the case. If you cannot have a discussion without trying to twist opinions to somehow suit your own agenda or in an attempt to make the poster out to have opinions that they clearly have not, then a suggest you refrain from quoting them (in this case, me).

Have a Nice Day now.

[btajim]

But Jim, you are clearly stating the FACT that I somehow wish to persevere with our current forward line-up when it definately isn't the case. If you cannot have a discussion without trying to twist opinions to somehow suit your own agenda or in an attempt to make the poster out to have opinions that they clearly have not, then a suggest you refrain from quoting them (in this case, me).

Have a Nice Day now.

Can you put your England Team for the Slovenia Match in the relevant thread, please? I'll look forwards to dissecting it once I get back from my Counselling session.