Our Status

[btajim]

I think it's you who doesn't know what you're talking about. I'll accept out of the prem Rooney, Terry, Torres, Fabregas and Gerrard and also throw into the mix Drogba and Lampard. So there's 7.

Then from Spain you've got Ronaldo, Messi, Ibrahimovic, Iniesta, Xavi, Kaka, Casillas, Villa (all either Real or Barca) so when I said about 10 I was right it's 8 which is close enough and possibly 9 if/when Fabregas moves to Barca. That's without including the likes of Higuain, Alonso, Busquets and other really top players playing at either real or Barca.

The top players in Serie A like Pato, Eto'o, Maicon and Cesar can't hold a candle to the likes of what the prem and more so La Liga has to offer.

No, I think it's you who doesn't know. You've contradicted yourself yet again. You originally said there were 10 of 15 in two Clubs at La Liga yet we've now got 10 + 7 = 15? 8 is about 10? You should do the books at Man Ure. Eto'o is better than Ibrahimovic, too.

City have such a long way to go before we have the pulling power of Barca (institution) and Real Madrid (history.) The hard work is yet to come. We're yet to qualify for the Champions League whilst Arsenal and Man Ure manage it continually.

[edge275]

I think it's you who doesn't know what you're talking about. I'll accept out of the prem Rooney, Terry, Torres, Fabregas and Gerrard and also throw into the mix Drogba and Lampard. So there's 7.

Then from Spain you've got Ronaldo, Messi, Ibrahimovic, Iniesta, Xavi, Kaka, Casillas, Villa (all either Real or Barca) so when I said about 10 I was right it's 8 which is close enough and possibly 9 if/when Fabregas moves to Barca. That's without including the likes of Higuain, Alonso, Busquets and other really top players playing at either real or Barca.

The top players in Serie A like Pato, Eto'o, Maicon and Cesar can't hold a candle to the likes of what the prem and more so La Liga has to offer.

No, I think it's you who doesn't know. You've contradicted yourself yet again. You originally said there were 10 of 15 in two Clubs at La Liga yet we've now got 10 + 7 = 15? 8 is about 10? You should do the books at Man Ure. Eto'o is better than Ibrahimovic, too.

City have such a long way to go before we have the pulling power of Barca (institution) and Real Madrid (history.) The hard work is yet to come. We're yet to qualify for the Champions League whilst Arsenal and Man Ure manage it continually.

Re read what I said. I said 'about 10'. It was just a guesstimate. I've named you 8 which will more than likely turn to 9 once Fabregas leaves.

I haven't contradicted myself in the slightest by saying 'about 10' and naming you 8/9. it's not as if I said 'about 10' and gave you 2. I think you're just clutching at straws because you know your argument of Serie A being strong looks lunacy. It's strong if you want to compare it to say, the Belgian league though, if that gives you any satisfaction.

There is an argument for Eto'o to potentially be in there instead of Ibrahimovic so you've possibly got 1 for Serie A which is borderline in the top 15.

As I was saying, Serie A is weak compared to La Liga and Premier League. Stick to the bible.

[Beefymcfc]

Was is strange for me, but understandable, is that we are now invited to talk with the worlds biggest clubs. Sitting around the table with the likes of Madrid, Milan and Barca just seems somewhat.............................strange.

[btajim]

Re read what I said. I said 'about 10'. It was just a guesstimate. I've named you 8 which will more than likely turn to 9 once Fabregas leaves.

I haven't contradicted myself in the slightest by saying 'about 10' and naming you 8/9. it's not as if I said 'about 10' and gave you 2. I think you're just clutching at straws because you know your argument of Serie A being strong looks lunacy. It's strong if you want to compare it to say, the Belgian league though, if that gives you any satisfaction.

There is an argument for Eto'o to potentially be in there instead of Ibrahimovic so you've possibly got 1 for Serie A which is borderline in the top 15.

As I was saying, Serie A is weak compared to La Liga and Premier League. Stick to the bible.

Serie A is stronger than the Leagues in France, Portugal, Holland, Scandinavia and Eastern Europe! You've put it down as if it's some paltry Beazer Homes Division 3 yet it's in the Top 3 in the World still. Serie A? Pah! I'd rather sign for Watford as it's near North London.

You're the one making threads on a forum yet I'm not remotely convinced by most of what you're saying. You're changing your mind when put under pressure and being vague. Thankfully City haven't asked you to negotiate some deals this summer.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

The problem is edge we've been using this destined to win this and that argument for 2 years and still have nowt to show for it. Arsenal are still top 4 every year and therefore a much more attractive prospect.

Can't say juve haven't won anything for 7 years then ignore our 3+ decades can u mate?

[john@staustell]

Arsenal are a bad example because of all the top teams they're the tightest, which is why they lose top players and never sign megastars anymore.

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

We are talked of as one of the 'Premier greats' abroad, mentioned first nowadays in many cases.

There is no shame in being beaten to a player by Real and Barca is there? In effect they have a whole load of glamour surrounding them that the rainy English clubs can never have. At least we are shopping in Waitrose instead of Lidl like Scum and the Dippers.

We are at a point where Scum cant compete with us all of a sudden, nor Arsenal nor certainly 'the history Dippers'. Chelski are thinking twice.

Seems good status to me, so hang on for the ride. It's next season that matters now, not everything past!

[Beefymcfc]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

[btajim]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

There are some good Clubs in the Europa next season - but it took until the Quarter Finals for City to face a strong side in the form of Hamburg. Schalke and PSG or Bayern Munich and Real Madrid? You'd want to play against the very best.

[DoomMerchant]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

There are some good Clubs in the Europa next season - but it took until the Quarter Finals for City to face a strong side in the form of Hamburg. Schalke and PSG or Bayern Munich and Real Madrid? You'd want to play against the very best.

There are shades of gray in this debate for sure. It's a richly woven tapestry of what the player has already achieved, their pay packet, their belief in what their new club will offer them in terms of limelight, or for some of the ability to get out of the limelight, and both personal and team potential in the immediate and long-term sense plus the history and image of the club from a global perspective in terms of their marketing opportunities and more importantly the kind of influence that the club history might have stamped upon them as kids dreaming of playing for xxxx team or in xxxx league.

As a result we are doing the right thing bringing in really talented youth like Kompany, Boateng, Johnson, and coupling it with some broken wing world class talent like given, ade, and tevez.

We wont get torres. Or messi. Or Xavi. Or terry. But we can get the next level player down and that's ok. A team will win. Not one or two marquee superstars.

This summer:

Getting the balance right > signing a Torres or Kaka, etc

Cheers

Cheers

[gillie]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

There are some good Clubs in the Europa next season - but it took until the Quarter Finals for City to face a strong side in the form of Hamburg. Schalke and PSG or Bayern Munich and Real Madrid? You'd want to play against the very best.

There are shades of gray in this debate for sure. It's a richly woven tapestry of what the player has already achieved, their pay packet, their belief in what their new club will offer them in terms of limelight, or for some of the ability to get out of the limelight, and both personal and team potential in the immediate and long-term sense plus the history and image of the club from a global perspective in terms of their marketing opportunities and more importantly the kind of influence that the club history might have stamped upon them as kids dreaming of playing for xxxx team or in xxxx league.

As a result we are doing the right thing bringing in really talented youth like Kompany, Boateng, Johnson, and coupling it with some broken wing world class talent like given, ade, and tevez.

We wont get torres. Or messi. Or Xavi. Or terry. But we can get the next level player down and that's ok. A team will win. Not one or two marquee superstars.

This summer:

Getting the balance right > signing a Torres or Kaka, etc

Cheers

Cheers

Doomy i dont say this often about your posts well in fact never before but this one is nailed on the money mate.

[mcfc1632]

Good post Edge, nice read. However, as a few others have stated, the draw of the Champions League cannot be overlooked and a lot of players would not join us without it; even though we know different they'd be classed as money grabbers, a tag that many do not like.

So, even though there are probably many out there who want to join us, the lack of prestige that is the Champions League is seeing us come up short, a thing that the likes of Arsenal et al hold over us. Hopefully not too long now.

Maybe if the player was signing a one year deal, but otherwise I don't think they would.

You mention Arsenal, a player snubs us to go and play there and cites 'Champions League' as his reason. However, next year Arsenal might not even be in the top 4 themselves and then what is the player gonna do?

We have more chance of winning the Champions League in the next 5 years than Arsenal in my opinion.

I think we will be a better side than Arsenal next year and therefore we would have a better chance of the league, FA cup and carling cup than they will have.

The only thing they have on us is the Champions League as you say but in all honesty, what's their chances of winning it next year without Fabregas as well?

Good posts Edge and I am in your camp

Yes CL is important - generally it has been a given - as it is the old regular CL clubs that could offer the big bucks - but we have broken that position and I think that most star players in the world are now aware of that - most are aware that it is 'only a matter of time' for us

I also think that we will be ahead of some of the top teams you mention in some circumstances - already the scum avoid getting into a bidding war with us and the selling clubs that hold the player registraations would rather sell to us

On the CL front - would any star player go to Spuds ahead of us? - I do not think so - no our position is very strong as you say - would be stronger with CL as others have said - but the blue moon is well and truly risen

[Beefymcfc]

Good post Edge, nice read. However, as a few others have stated, the draw of the Champions League cannot be overlooked and a lot of players would not join us without it; even though we know different they'd be classed as money grabbers, a tag that many do not like.

So, even though there are probably many out there who want to join us, the lack of prestige that is the Champions League is seeing us come up short, a thing that the likes of Arsenal et al hold over us. Hopefully not too long now.

Maybe if the player was signing a one year deal, but otherwise I don't think they would.

You mention Arsenal, a player snubs us to go and play there and cites 'Champions League' as his reason. However, next year Arsenal might not even be in the top 4 themselves and then what is the player gonna do?

We have more chance of winning the Champions League in the next 5 years than Arsenal in my opinion.

I think we will be a better side than Arsenal next year and therefore we would have a better chance of the league, FA cup and carling cup than they will have.

The only thing they have on us is the Champions League as you say but in all honesty, what's their chances of winning it next year without Fabregas as well?

Good posts Edge and I am in your camp

Yes CL is important - generally it has been a given - as it is the old regular CL clubs that could offer the big bucks - but we have broken that position and I think that most star players in the world are now aware of that - most are aware that it is 'only a matter of time' for us

I also think that we will be ahead of some of the top teams you mention in some circumstances - already the scum avoid getting into a bidding war with us and the selling clubs that hold the player registraations would rather sell to us

On the CL front - would any star player go to Spuds ahead of us? - I do not think so - no our position is very strong as you say - would be stronger with CL as others have said - but the blue moon is well and truly risen

I disagree, but check Doomy's post above,it's all swings and round-a-bouts!

Just to add, we've progressed more rapidly than any of us could have imagined, the likes of Robbie, Carlos, Kolo or Ade joining was pretty unprecedented at the time but when you look at their situation, then you realise why they came. Hughes did very well to get those players in and now Mancio is trying to take it to another level. We are now in a far better situation than we were last year and the thought (to players) that we can win the Premier League has to be a major draw.

[halnone]

we can't be considered a world class club until we get our stadium in the FIFA games...

[DoomMerchant]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

There are some good Clubs in the Europa next season - but it took until the Quarter Finals for City to face a strong side in the form of Hamburg. Schalke and PSG or Bayern Munich and Real Madrid? You'd want to play against the very best.

There are shades of gray in this debate for sure. It's a richly woven tapestry of what the player has already achieved, their pay packet, their belief in what their new club will offer them in terms of limelight, or for some of the ability to get out of the limelight, and both personal and team potential in the immediate and long-term sense plus the history and image of the club from a global perspective in terms of their marketing opportunities and more importantly the kind of influence that the club history might have stamped upon them as kids dreaming of playing for xxxx team or in xxxx league.

As a result we are doing the right thing bringing in really talented youth like Kompany, Boateng, Johnson, and coupling it with some broken wing world class talent like given, ade, and tevez.

We wont get torres. Or messi. Or Xavi. Or terry. But we can get the next level player down and that's ok. A team will win. Not one or two marquee superstars.

This summer:

Getting the balance right > signing a Torres or Kaka, etc

Cheers

Cheers

Doomy i dont say this often about your posts well in fact never before but this one is nailed on the money mate.

I don't say this often but i think yr right Gillie.

mods -- lock the thread. Gillie's declared victory on my behalf.

Cheers

[Beefymcfc]

There are shades of gray in this debate for sure. It's a richly woven tapestry of what the player has already achieved, their pay packet, their belief in what their new club will offer them in terms of limelight, or for some of the ability to get out of the limelight, and both personal and team potential in the immediate and long-term sense plus the history and image of the club from a global perspective in terms of their marketing opportunities and more importantly the kind of influence that the club history might have stamped upon them as kids dreaming of playing for xxxx team or in xxxx league.

As a result we are doing the right thing bringing in really talented youth like Kompany, Boateng, Johnson, and coupling it with some broken wing world class talent like given, ade, and tevez.

We wont get torres. Or messi. Or Xavi. Or terry. But we can get the next level player down and that's ok. A team will win. Not one or two marquee superstars.

This summer:

Getting the balance right > signing a Torres or Kaka, etc

Cheers

Cheers

Doomy i dont say this often about your posts well in fact never before but this one is nailed on the money mate.

I don't say this often but i think yr right Gillie.

mods -- lock the thread. Gillie's declared victory on my behalf.

Cheers

Yep, lock it Mods, they're definately turning Darren!

[Im_Spartacus]

Re read what I said. I said 'about 10'. It was just a guesstimate. I've named you 8 which will more than likely turn to 9 once Fabregas leaves.

I haven't contradicted myself in the slightest by saying 'about 10' and naming you 8/9. it's not as if I said 'about 10' and gave you 2. I think you're just clutching at straws because you know your argument of Serie A being strong looks lunacy. It's strong if you want to compare it to say, the Belgian league though, if that gives you any satisfaction.

There is an argument for Eto'o to potentially be in there instead of Ibrahimovic so you've possibly got 1 for Serie A which is borderline in the top 15.

As I was saying, Serie A is weak compared to La Liga and Premier League. Stick to the bible.

Serie A is stronger than the Leagues in France, Portugal, Holland, Scandinavia and Eastern Europe! You've put it down as if it's some paltry Beazer Homes Division 3 yet it's in the Top 3 in the World still. Serie A? Pah! I'd rather sign for Watford as it's near North London.

You're the one making threads on a forum yet I'm not remotely convinced by most of what you're saying. You're changing your mind when put under pressure and being vague. Thankfully City haven't asked you to negotiate some deals this summer.

Serie A is a poor league these days mate it has deteriorated ever since they started breaking up the Milan team in the early/mid 90s. There was a spell when the likes of Zidane, Maldini, Ronaldo, Seedorf, Nedved, Totti were strutting their stuff in their prime, but how many players in serie A since the scandals started are even fit to lace the boots of the likes of those players. Eto is a decent player, but a world beater? Pato is not even in his national squad.

If we accept that England and Spain are the top 2, then fair enough Italy may be in a 3rd/4th place play off with Germany, but Serie A cannot hold a candle to what England and Spain has to offer.

Its not about whether Edge said 3 teams, 10 teams or 30 teams, what he is saying in general is perfectly correct regardless of the maths (which I suspect you already know), something I expect that the Italian posters on here would agree with.

[john@staustell]

I basically agree with Edge in that all that matters to players today is money. CL football is a media myth taken up by many fans like sheep.

I agree with most of your post John, but that is just silly. Did Kaka accept the money or what about Ronaldinho and Eto'o? Will Gerrard or Torres take the plunge and would Yaya really consider us if his brother wasn't here?

It's not a media myth, it's a fact that the CL has a massive pull for the very top names, their ego's come first, money comes second.

I still maintain that most players - who complain about playing too much for their money - are not too bothered about CL. The key thing is that at the time of the Kaka saga our 'status' was next to nothing. By Eto'o time it was higher and that was touch and go - Ibrahimovic involvement being pretty key. As Edge says now - just a few months down the line really - we are right up there in 'status', due to our constant media profile and the likes of Tevez playing well for us, stuffing the likes of Chelsea etc. We now make them all sit up and take notice.

I would point out that AC Milan were not in the CL when they beat us to fat Ronnie were they? But we were nothing then. Clubs like Real, Barca, AC and Inter will always have that 'status' even when they dont qualify for CL - the status that makes players want to join them. Edge's point is that we are now getting that status, and players want status and MONEY!

[brite blu sky]

it is interesting in this thread how much is assumed of what players really want..

i mean for starters all players are different.. they may start out as kids with the same kind of archetypal dreams.. of scoring a fantastic goal to clinch a major trophy for their dream team.. but in working their way into the system of pro football they are going to grow up and develop ideas relevant to themselves. I think it is too much to second guess what as individuals they want or see as the best way to go. Money obviously makes a key arguement. But hardly anyone mentions the idea of becoming a better player and going where they make the right noises to make players beleive that. Arsenal are probably very attractive to young players who want a challenge and to get better, knowing that Wenger is a manger that is tried and tested in that approach.

In time i think City will become like that.. with the slightly added bonus of having the money to bring in the occasional superstar to mix it up.

As City fans we are all thinking (as in the MEN survey ) that we will win something in the next 3 years and that will probs be the tilte. I think becuase of our inherent scepticism of all things City, that may well be a conservative enough perception to not be out of tune with the rest of the football community. Spurs fans think City will storm past them. the rags are worried.. Arseanl will be.. the press accept that we are going to get there come what may. So players are not going to be thinking that much differently.. although you can probably safely say that there are the players that can see the idea of getting in there with the project and others who are not really influenced by that and want it now. Some players possibly see themselves as being too important to go to a club that is not considered a top top team, but their judgment of that is probably personal.
Look at Liverpool.. with now what appears to be a bit of a crisis in that they could lose their key players for the same reason they wont be able to attract new key players.. they cant invest enough in the team to ensure a fair shot at getting out of the trouble they are in. We dont have the status of Liverpool as a club if you look at it in a traditional way, but we are in a far far far better situation than the Scouce.. in all probability we are going to have a better team and squad than the rags in 2-3 years and a lot of people can see that as a real possibilty, so if you are a footballer who wants to get to the top, City are a good horse to back.. and right now there is a lot of opportunity to become a mainstay player in that team.. i would say that is very attractive to ambitious players and it tips the balance somewhat in calculating our status amongst the established clubs.


What i think personally about some of the top teams at present..

Positives adding to Status
Madrid - Ambition, Mourinho, Top Squad, Money, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Spain, High Status League.
Barcelona - Ambition, Best System of play, Top Squad, Money, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Spain, High Status League.
Chelsea - Ambition, Top Squad, Money, Life in London, High Status League.
City - Most Ambitious, Mancini, Top Squad, Most Money, Legendary Status on offer, High Status League.
rags - Ambition?, Baconface, Tradition of Top World Club, High Status League.
Arsenal - Ambition?, Wenger, Tradition of Top Club, Life in London, High Status League.
Inter Milan - Ambition, Tradition of Top Club, Good Status League.
AC Milan - Tradition of Top World Club, Good Status League.
Juve - Tradition of Top World Club, Good Status League.
Bayern - Ambiton, Top Squad, Good Manager, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Munich.

Negatives detracting from status
Madrid - Notoriously fickle, Currently Overspending, can seem to get it right to win. Dodgy President situation.
Barcelona - Difficult to make a mark on their style and so be valuable to them. Manager still unknown quantity.
Chelsea - Aging Squad, fickle with managers. Not as much money.
City - Not established top club, Manchester climate.
rags - Look financially shakey, Aging team, No money, Dodgy Owners situation, Manchester climate.
Arsenal - Dont Win, weaker sqaud, Less Money.
Inter Milan - New Manager, Aging sqaud, Less Money, Living in a dump.
AC Milan - Dont WIn, Manager Problems, Less Money, Living in a dump.
Juve - Dont Win, Manager Problems?, Less Money, Living in a dump.
Bayern - Bit Lower Status League, Bit less Money?

[DoomMerchant]

it is interesting in this thread how much is assumed of what players really want..

i mean for starters all players are different.. they may start out as kids with the same kind of archetypal dreams.. of scoring a fantastic goal to clinch a major trophy for their dream team.. but in working their way into the system of pro football they are going to grow up and develop ideas relevant to themselves. I think it is too much to second guess what as individuals they want or see as the best way to go. Money obviously makes a key arguement. But hardly anyone mentions the idea of becoming a better player and going where they make the right noises to make players beleive that. Arsenal are probably very attractive to young players who want a challenge and to get better, knowing that Wenger is a manger that is tried and tested in that approach.

In time i think City will become like that.. with the slightly added bonus of having the money to bring in the occasional superstar to mix it up.

As City fans we are all thinking (as in the MEN survey ) that we will win something in the next 3 years and that will probs be the tilte. I think becuase of our inherent scepticism of all things City, that may well be a conservative enough perception to not be out of tune with the rest of the football community. Spurs fans think City will storm past them. the rags are worried.. Arseanl will be.. the press accept that we are going to get there come what may. So players are not going to be thinking that much differently.. although you can probably safely say that there are the players that can see the idea of getting in there with the project and others who are not really influenced by that and want it now. Some players possibly see themselves as being too important to go to a club that is not considered a top top team, but their judgment of that is probably personal.
Look at Liverpool.. with now what appears to be a bit of a crisis in that they could lose their key players for the same reason they wont be able to attract new key players.. they cant invest enough in the team to ensure a fair shot at getting out of the trouble they are in. We dont have the status of Liverpool as a club if you look at it in a traditional way, but we are in a far far far better situation than the Scouce.. in all probability we are going to have a better team and squad than the rags in 2-3 years and a lot of people can see that as a real possibilty, so if you are a footballer who wants to get to the top, City are a good horse to back.. and right now there is a lot of opportunity to become a mainstay player in that team.. i would say that is very attractive to ambitious players and it tips the balance somewhat in calculating our status amongst the established clubs.


What i think personally about some of the top teams at present..

Positives adding to Status
Madrid - Ambition, Mourinho, Top Squad, Money, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Spain, High Status League.
Barcelona - Ambition, Best System of play, Top Squad, Money, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Spain, High Status League.
Chelsea - Ambition, Top Squad, Money, Life in London, High Status League.
City - Most Ambitious, Mancini, Top Squad, Most Money, Legendary Status on offer, High Status League.
rags - Ambition?, Baconface, Tradition of Top World Club, High Status League.
Arsenal - Ambition?, Wenger, Tradition of Top Club, Life in London, High Status League.
Inter Milan - Ambition, Tradition of Top Club, Good Status League.
AC Milan - Tradition of Top World Club, Good Status League.
Juve - Tradition of Top World Club, Good Status League.
Bayern - Ambiton, Top Squad, Good Manager, Tradition of Top World Club, Life in Munich.

Negatives detracting from status
Madrid - Notoriously fickle, Currently Overspending, can seem to get it right to win. Dodgy President situation.
Barcelona - Difficult to make a mark on their style and so be valuable to them. Manager still unknown quantity.
Chelsea - Aging Squad, fickle with managers. Not as much money.
City - Not established top club, Manchester climate.
rags - Look financially shakey, Aging team, No money, Dodgy Owners situation, Manchester climate.
Arsenal - Dont Win, weaker sqaud, Less Money.
Inter Milan - New Manager, Aging sqaud, Less Money, Living in a dump.
AC Milan - Dont WIn, Manager Problems, Less Money, Living in a dump.
Juve - Dont Win, Manager Problems?, Less Money, Living in a dump.
Bayern - Bit Lower Status League, Bit less Money?

jesus fucl. next time just do one of those "this" thingys in response to my earlier post. It'll save you like 45 minutes of rambled typing, editing, etc.

Gillie was right. What a game he's created here. Who's next?

cheers

[brite blu sky]

jesus fucl. next time just do one of those "this" thingys in response to my earlier post. It'll save you like 45 minutes of rambled typing, editing, etc.

Gillie was right. What a game he's created here. Who's next?

cheers

this