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I want to know why. Why does it happen? Are the players under instruction? Are the midfielders being lazy and not presenting options? Are our defenders just too used to doing it? Is Ade our Peter Crouch and players just assume that if they kick it to him he'll get it.

It frustrates the living crap out of me. Our best passages of play against Scouse1 was when we kept the ball on the deck. Why do we go long and give it back to the opposition?

Give me some theories people?

PS. If you are going to blame Leslie for this, please feel free to do so. However try and offer a reason why. Because he's shit is not an acceptable reason.

We are missing Didi Haman. Everthing used to go through him or Elano from the defence. They now have no one to spread around accurate passes and sweep has forgotten how to beat his man, so everything goes back to Shay who then lumps it up in the air with no direction. This then just causes the ball to come straight back at us from the oposition and is why the defence is struggling so badly. No one from the defence or midfield is capable of easing the pressure by making a accurate pass forward out of defence

I just think that when we have two more negative players in the center of the park, the only way forward looks like to pump it long ... Doesnt help that Barry is off the boil at the moment too as he's usually not as negative as he's been recently.

Hopefully against Dull we'll have Robson back in the side up front, with Stevie, DeJong and maybe Johnson too making up our central 3 we'll have more channels to play the ball out.

But there's no problem with mixing it a little, sometimes the Arse would play a sweet long ball if they're unable to break through with thier normal play ...

Part of how you play the game is effected by the opposition. If they press hard and move their midfield up the park it gets difficult (and risky) to pass through them but at the same time their defenders are isolated for long balls. It can be a good way to make a defences job harder and create space elsewhere.

When you're playing a counter attacking game you want to get the ball moving forward quickly, that involves an increased risk of giving the ball away. When we're playing well as a team, we pass on the deck. When we're being disrupted and are unsure of ourselves we're less likely to take risks. Occasionally this year we can find the gap between midfield and defence, or between midfield and attack cap creep up a little with the result that it becomes a lot harder to build an attack.

When attacking players are getting caught in possession too easily then possession can become a liability.

Ah, but we have a mixture at the moment. Often they play their way out, then we also have the option of a long ball to Ade or RSC. With these 2 who can actually hold up a long ball (unlike previously) it allows us to put the pressure in the opposition half.

Some of the football we play is pretty good, there's just some poor decision-making in the last quarter and some poor finishing. Also trying to play your way through 11 men is not always easy.

Having a long ball out option to clear the lines is not a bad thing.

We used to just kick it upfield to people who immediately lost it FFS.

We have been playing that tactic far too much recently and it comes from Toure - he pumps it long nearly every time to Adebayor and they often wave at each other after a failed attempt to encourage each other.

Lescott dilly-dallys on the ball too long all angles get cut off so he pumps it long often as well.

De Jong, Ireland and Barry do not move enough in the middle of the park to create triangles - instead they actively seem to mark up against the opposing midfielders. When De Jong does drop deep enough he doesn't pass the ball forward, only sideways so we go back to the defence.

I believe they are under instruction to use a mixture of both depending on the situation. Sometimes we do try and pass it about but because of the lack of movement you get this situation occuring all too often....

Given rolls the ball out to Lescott
Lescott pushes it out to Bridge, bridge is cut off passes it back to Lescott,
Lescott gives it to Toure, who is closed down, Toure a) pumps it long to Adebayor b) passes to Zabaleta
Zabaleta trys a forward pass to a marked Ireland in the centre circle who passes it to a) De Jong b) Barry who gets tackled as he is unaware of anything around him
De Jong is too close to Ireland and is closed down quickly, ball back to Lescott
Lescott a) pumps the ball long to Adebayor but goes straight to their keeper b) passes to Bridge
Bridge pumps the ball down the line for Bellamy to chase

Good to see that even you are pissed off.

I think it's combination of all the above and more.

The movement of our central midfielders when Ireland is not on the pitch is non-existent. De Jong gets praised alot for his defensive qualities but in very undutchmanlike fashion he rarely looks to become available for pass when we are holding the ball. Barry on the other hand is very dynamic at his best but isn't really a playmaker who actively asks for the ball all the time. This is also one of the reason why Tevez constantly drops too deep as he is asking for the ball but this means he isn't there to finish the moves when needed.

Adebayor is good striker but obviously strong in the air and striker like that makes it too easy for defenders and midfielders to hoof it long when under pressure. The fact that we bought Santa Cruz makes me feel that this is the kind of football Hughes prefers, right or wrong.

The biggest reason for me though is the distances and gaps between attackers and defenders. It is old saying, but very much valid, that good team ALWAYS attacks and defends as a team and we simply aren't doing that right now. We rely too heavily on wingers to take the ball and run 70 yards with it brisging those gaps and that's one of the reasons why SWP for instance isn't looking too good all the time. He is simply being asked to do too much. When a good passing side gets a ball the whole team moves forward quickly and EVERYONE starting from keeper constantly look to open for a pass. In the same way when we don't have a ball, everyone try to actively defend as an unit. Right now the standard is that when we win the ball, the distance between Adebayor and Lexcott is 90 yards.

As all these players have been able to work as a team in their previous clubs, I can only put majority of blame on Hughes' shoulders.

I missed the game against Scouse1 but I don't know if I think we play the long ball more than the average (top) team. It's inevitable to use on occasion for a number of reasons. I don't see a problem with using it just to change things up and keep the opposition guessing. Especially now we have players (Ade or RSC) up there who could actually win the odd header. You don't have to have +60% possession every game like the Arse to win the league.

That said, I think we could be more patient and keep the ball in our back four when we're not under pressure, it's a matter of confidence.

Barry & De Jong play just infront of the defenders therefore there is no longer outlet further up the pitch. SWP has forgotten that he is there to go round the oppositions left back. The midfielders are too far away from the strikers to link up effectively, or quick enough. Lump the ball up to the big man, Ade, hope it sticks and get up the pitch to the strikers out and hope we are quick enough isn't a very good tactic.
The game changed against Liverpool when Tevez came on and he became the link between the forwards and the back line and if he keeps that sort of form up then i think we'll see less long balls from our defenders.

I dont give a shit about long ball tactics.

I JUST WANT DOUG TO BE GIVEN A PASS.

Come on Hughes get it sorted.

You have got wonder at the brains of a set of players who, with five midfielders on the field and the knowledge that Adebayor and Tevez both prefer the ball to feet, twat the ball over the heads of the midfield to a centre-forward with two men on him.

If the manager is telling them to do it, then they should ignore the daft fucker and play football. And if the manager is telling them to do it, why not just go all out for it and play a 4-2-4 with four big, strong, quick front men (which might possibly see that tactic work) instead of a 4-5-1/4-3-3 full of bloody midgets? The colossal sums of money he has spent could have been pushed in this direction but they haven't really other than RSC.

It would help if Gareth Barry hadn't lost his nerve / form a little bit. Resting him and replacing him with Johnson for a while until GB gets his form and confidence back would help. It will help when we have got Robinho back, the only player we can rely on to beat his man on a regular basis. Pushing Ireland further forward or giving him licence to roam would also give our defenders more passing options, as has been pointed out earlier. Playing on a wider pitch at home also helps us.

I don't think we play it any more than anyone else.

Anyway, the majority of long balls get headed out by the opposition and then contested & picked up in midfield. Problem is we're useless at that too!

Bring back Keegan!!

AND ANOTHER THING - WHY CANT BRIDGE RELEASE THE FUCKING BALL QUICKLY........HOW MANY TIMES DID HE GET CLOSED DOWN ON THE WING THERE AND THE BALL WENT OUT FOR A THROWING???????????????

HE SHOULD FUCKING STUDY CASHLEY COLE AND LEARN FROM HIM.


THAT REALLY ANNOYS ME.

Where to start. Actually it's all been said except for the fact that there isn't a long ball tactic! All the reasons why it happens are covered but it is not something that they plan to do or practice.
To switch the play at times yes but that's a long cross field ball aimed at a free man but the long hopeful ball should only be played when the defender is in a dangerous position or on the occasion where the oppostion have pushed up and the chance of a long pass over the top is on. What has been happening a little too often is down to all the things already covered plus a bit of a lack of confidence I think.

I noticed that some players aren't wanting the ball. Tevez/SWP and Ireland always seems to want it, but De Jong and Barry sometimes pass the ball to someone and then forget about making themselves available to take a simple pass back.

De Jong passed to someone in a match on the left who had a couple of people on him and turned his back and me and my mate both noticed that he just walked off after the pass! He should have been giving him another option.

Ezz wrote:I noticed that some players aren't wanting the ball. Tevez/SWP and Ireland always seems to want it, but De Jong and Barry sometimes pass the ball to someone and then forget about making themselves available to take a simple pass back.

De Jong passed to someone in a match on the left who had a couple of people on him and turned his back and me and my mate both noticed that he just walked off after the pass! He should have been giving him another option.

And those 2 in particular are key to passing the ball from the back. It's a key part of the game NDJ should be playing.

The lack of taking responsibility of the ball was comical at Anfield at one moment in the first half out by the far touchline.

De Jong and Ireland passed it back to each other, stood about 7 yards away from each other, about 3 or 4 times before being tackled by Gerrard I think. Both of them were treating it like a hot potato.

De Jong and Ireland annoy the hell of out me at times for their basic passing in the centre. De Jong never passes forwards even when there is a easy pass on - he doesn't move enough around the centre to make himself available for passes.

Ireland never takes control of the ball as he has the skill to do so. He is consistantly playing one or two touch football. When Lescott and Toure pass to him he immediately passes it back without turning and looking. One touch football is great when getting near the opposing 18 yard line but not in the centre of park when you can hold it and move.

I thought Barry would be our answer to this passing problem from defence into midfield as he has such a good left foot but I've been shocked at how easy it is to tackle him as his spacial awareness is unbelievably poor for a pro footballer. He also seems to get flustered very easily.

I honestly think De Jong is the main problem here. Now not to slag the guy off as he does some top stuff and was a monster at the weekend, but he always plays the safe option. This may lead to him making a compketed pass, but it also allows the oppostition to set up stall and prepare themselves.

2 things keep hitting my mind, despite how well he has played as an individual, since De Jong has come into the 11, we have stopped keeping clean sheets and stopped the free flowing attadcking football. 1st three games with Barry as our most def minded mid and Robbie on board the other sides barely got a sniff as we had the ball in their final 3rd most of the game.

lets all have a disco wrote:I dont give a shit about long ball tactics.

I JUST WANT DOUG TO BE GIVEN A PASS.

Come on Hughes get it sorted.

At least LAHAD, while we are doing the long ball option so much it also gives Doug less need for larger ladders.

Thanks everyone for collectively saving me the need to type so much...

Players panicking
Defence and attack too far apart
De Jong needs to do more off the ball running
De Jong needs to learn to pass forwards occasionally
De Jong

Do you remember the days when everyone blamed Dunne (me included) and said "if Hughes could replace Dunne with better ball-playing defenders we wouldn't have this problem".... so we have Toure (ex-midfielder) and we are still hoofing the ball hopefully to a target man....