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I'd love us to finish 4th. If we can offer CL we'll sign better players and having suffered at the hands of Spurs on many occasions, it would be nice to serve them a cold dish. No big disaster if we don't get 4th. It'll just take a bit longer to get where we wanna be. On the plus side we should be clear favourites for the Europa league and that could finally see that effing banner come down. looking at the players that got us to the qf and the squad we have now we'll be in with a very good shout. It'll also give players a years experience of playing in Europe before the CL.

Original Dub wrote:
Just out of interest - are you very confident we'll secure fourth and if not, why not?

I'm not and it's mostly down to super form of Tottenham, easy fixtures Villa have left and tough fixture list we have left. I reckon we'll finish 6th.

Cheers mate, I was just curious. So you're not feeling too positive then?

You'd think that two homes games and a game against a relegation threatened side would be enough to get us 9 points. And you have faith in the players and the manager... are you sure its because you think its such a tough run in, or because you're used to getting let down?

Personally, I think we'll do it, but I'm apprehensive about how we set out for these games. There is no doubt in my mind that we have the players to turn the last FOUR teams over, but I certainly feel we can get 9 points and that will get us fourth IMO.

And I'm seen as one of the more negative folk!

Original Dub wrote:Cheers mate, I was just curious. So you're not feeling too positive then?

You'd think that two homes games and a game against a relegation threatened side would be enough to get us 9 points. And you have faith in the players and the manager... are you sure its because you think its such a tough run in, or because you're used to getting let down?

Personally, I think we'll do it, but I'm apprehensive about how we set out for these games. There is no doubt in my mind that we have the players to turn the last FOUR teams over, but I certainly feel we can get 9 points and that will get us fourth IMO.

And I'm seen as one of the more negative folk!

the
money
on
bang

brite blu sky wrote:

Original Dub wrote:Cheers mate, I was just curious. So you're not feeling too positive then?

You'd think that two homes games and a game against a relegation threatened side would be enough to get us 9 points. And you have faith in the players and the manager... are you sure its because you think its such a tough run in, or because you're used to getting let down?

Personally, I think we'll do it, but I'm apprehensive about how we set out for these games. There is no doubt in my mind that we have the players to turn the last FOUR teams over, but I certainly feel we can get 9 points and that will get us fourth IMO.

And I'm seen as one of the more negative folk!

the
money
on
bang

Winners look at what they can achieve, losers look at what they can throw away.

Be a winner.

Slim wrote:

brite blu sky wrote:

Original Dub wrote:Cheers mate, I was just curious. So you're not feeling too positive then?

You'd think that two homes games and a game against a relegation threatened side would be enough to get us 9 points. And you have faith in the players and the manager... are you sure its because you think its such a tough run in, or because you're used to getting let down?

Personally, I think we'll do it, but I'm apprehensive about how we set out for these games. There is no doubt in my mind that we have the players to turn the last FOUR teams over, but I certainly feel we can get 9 points and that will get us fourth IMO.

And I'm seen as one of the more negative folk!

the
money
on
bang

Winners look at what they can achieve, losers look at what they can throw away.

Be a winner.

I don't remember that philosopy when we had a game or two in hand... actually, you were shouting people down when the games in hand were mentioned.

Maybe they were looking at what we could achieve... while YOU were looking at what we could throw away.

Oh the irony.

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:

Original Dub wrote:
Just out of interest - are you very confident we'll secure fourth and if not, why not?

I'm not and it's mostly down to super form of Tottenham, easy fixtures Villa have left and tough fixture list we have left. I reckon we'll finish 6th.

Villa have easy games left, NQDP? They've got to come to City. Nothing easy about that! *cough*

6th?! Would you give Mancini another season if he guides us to 6th?

not sure it is valid, but i notice that there are two things that go on in a smaller forum like this, one being chatting and debating the team and City, the other being debating each other and the forum itself.

cheers.. in a Doomy kind of way

Original Dub wrote:I don't remember that philosopy when we had a game or two in hand... actually, you were shouting people down when the games in hand were mentioned.

Maybe they were looking at what we could achieve... while YOU were looking at what we could throw away.

Oh the irony.

There is a difference between counting games as wins before you have played them and looking at what we could achieve.

Of course your comments that "we're in 4th if we win our game(s) in hand" stopped after Mancini came in, even though it was Mancini who was in charge vs Everton and we assume will be vs Tottenham.

Hopefully some of that got through, maybe some cause for introspection? Then again, maybe just another forum for you to throw out your passive-aggressive Mancini undermining. Your choice of course.

Slim wrote:

Original Dub wrote:I don't remember that philosopy when we had a game or two in hand... actually, you were shouting people down when the games in hand were mentioned.

Maybe they were looking at what we could achieve... while YOU were looking at what we could throw away.

Oh the irony.

There is a difference between counting games as wins before you have played them and looking at what we could achieve.

Of course your comments that "we're in 4th if we win our game(s) in hand" stopped after Mancini came in, even though it was Mancini who was in charge vs Everton and we assume will be vs Tottenham.

Hopefully some of that got through, maybe some cause for introspection? Then again, maybe just another forum for you to throw out your passive-aggressive Mancini undermining. Your choice of course.

"Passive aggressive, oooh leave him alone"... stop crying will you, I'm behind the man, I want him to succeed, I'm just apprehensive about how we set up for a draw against every top side we have met under him. It is top sides we are about to meet, so I'm hoping he has changed his philosophy so we can get fourth, which is all I'm "aggressive" about.

I'll say it yet again:

I don't care if its Hughes, Mancini, Sven or whoever, I only want fourth place because I want to see my team in the champions league. If I'm aprehensive about upcoming games (as you completely were about our games in hand that I mentioned above), then I have every right to voice it without having my support questioned, as you had when you showed the same aprehension oft times before.

Its not difficult to grasp. Really, it isn't.

Original Dub wrote:

Slim wrote:

Original Dub wrote:I don't remember that philosopy when we had a game or two in hand... actually, you were shouting people down when the games in hand were mentioned.

Maybe they were looking at what we could achieve... while YOU were looking at what we could throw away.

Oh the irony.

There is a difference between counting games as wins before you have played them and looking at what we could achieve.

Of course your comments that "we're in 4th if we win our game(s) in hand" stopped after Mancini came in, even though it was Mancini who was in charge vs Everton and we assume will be vs Tottenham.

Hopefully some of that got through, maybe some cause for introspection? Then again, maybe just another forum for you to throw out your passive-aggressive Mancini undermining. Your choice of course.

"Passive aggressive, oooh leave him alone"... stop crying will you, I'm behind the man, I want him to succeed, I'm just apprehensive about how we set up for a draw against every top side we have met under him. It is top sides we are about to meet, so I'm hoping he has changed his philosophy so we can get fourth, which is all I'm "aggressive" about.

I'll say it yet again:

I don't care if its Hughes, Mancini, Sven or whoever, I only want fourth place because I want to see my team in the champions league. If I'm aprehensive about upcoming games (as you completely were about our games in hand that I mentioned above), then I have every right to voice it without having my support questioned, as you had when you showed the same aprehension oft times before.

Its not difficult to grasp. Really, it isn't.

Remind me, what was the result at Stamford Bridge?

Slim wrote:

Original Dub wrote:

Slim wrote:

Original Dub wrote:I don't remember that philosopy when we had a game or two in hand... actually, you were shouting people down when the games in hand were mentioned.

Maybe they were looking at what we could achieve... while YOU were looking at what we could throw away.

Oh the irony.

There is a difference between counting games as wins before you have played them and looking at what we could achieve.

Of course your comments that "we're in 4th if we win our game(s) in hand" stopped after Mancini came in, even though it was Mancini who was in charge vs Everton and we assume will be vs Tottenham.

Hopefully some of that got through, maybe some cause for introspection? Then again, maybe just another forum for you to throw out your passive-aggressive Mancini undermining. Your choice of course.

"Passive aggressive, oooh leave him alone"... stop crying will you, I'm behind the man, I want him to succeed, I'm just apprehensive about how we set up for a draw against every top side we have met under him. It is top sides we are about to meet, so I'm hoping he has changed his philosophy so we can get fourth, which is all I'm "aggressive" about.

I'll say it yet again:

I don't care if its Hughes, Mancini, Sven or whoever, I only want fourth place because I want to see my team in the champions league. If I'm aprehensive about upcoming games (as you completely were about our games in hand that I mentioned above), then I have every right to voice it without having my support questioned, as you had when you showed the same aprehension oft times before.

Its not difficult to grasp. Really, it isn't.

Remind me, what was the result at Stamford Bridge?

Strange question.... it was 4-2 to us mate.

Doesn't mean we didn't look like we set up purely to not let them score, as we have done against all the top sides. It worked that time, how? I don't know, but it hasn't worked any other time and you think I'm being negative purely because I'm fearful we'll do it again?

Remind me, what was the league result against Everton, Liverpool & United?

This is a cool game.

on the face of it i think you have good point OD. as i mentioned at some point the games that you refer to were very close.. i would cite the idea that we were still getting better but still pretty nervous at the time of those games. But your point is very valid, we haven't seen convincing performances against the top sides in the sense you are talking about.. ie set up and intention of the team. Where we differ is that i feel we are learning and have less reason to be worried, but i would agree with you that we really need some clear evidence of that before being able to be totally confident.

well tomorrow is the next chance we have to try and show that. But if we do go and win, i for one will not be going overboard thinking it is in the bag, partly because Arsenal have a lot of problems.. a lot. imo they are there for the taking. Can City go for the jugular ?

brite blu sky wrote:on the face of it i think you have good point OD. as i mentioned at some point the games that you refer to were very close.. i would cite the idea that we were still getting better but still pretty nervous at the time of those games. But your point is very valid, we haven't seen convincing performances against the top sides in the sense you are talking about.. ie set up and intention of the team. Where we differ is that i feel we are learning and have less reason to be worried, but i would agree with you that we really need some clear evidence of that before being able to be totally confident.

well tomorrow is the next chance we have to try and show that. But if we do go and win, i for one will not be going overboard thinking it is in the bag, partly because Arsenal have a lot of problems.. a lot. imo they are there for the taking. Can City go for the jugular ?

Prior to the game against the scum I think we needed to win 3 games and probably 4th place is ours. One of those 3 wins had to be against Spurs as well plus we needed Spurs to lose a game along the way which was expected in the 3 tough games they had before us.

Well Spurs won 2 in a row playing really well and we lost the first of our toughies.The game against Arsenal isn't the key for us as long as Spurs lose to the scum as 3 wins in a row for us starting with Villa would still get us 4th. Ideally I would like 3 wins in a row starting tomorrow so that WHU isnt a must win.If we don't get 4th it will be a disappointment but shouldnt hide the overall positive steps we have taken.Patience was always needed.

Original Dub wrote:Strange question.... it was 4-2 to us mate.

Doesn't mean we didn't look like we set up purely to not let them score, as we have done against all the top sides. It worked that time, how? I don't know, but it hasn't worked any other time and you think I'm being negative purely because I'm fearful we'll do it again?

Remind me, what was the league result against Everton, Liverpool & U***d?

This is a cool game.

So we were set up to to draw against a team that hadn't lost at home in god knows how long, a team that not only hasn't lost a single home game this season but only got one draw and we scored 4, outplayed them and should have won 4-1 if it wasn't for that fucking ref giving away penalties like pennies.

I'd like to know why you choose top8 as your threshold and not top 6 considering that's who we have to play, or even top 10 if you wanted to separate the better teams in the league from the chaff. Wait, it's so you can avoid the fact we beat 9th and 10th, battered 9th in fact and if you go top 6, our record is w1, d1, l1.

Either way, if we include Everton we get w1 d1 l3 and if you include 10th, we get w3 d1 l3. In fact if you take all 17 games into account, we get w10 d3 l4. Hardly a team looking to draw matches is it? Maybe they are in fact looking to draw games, but aren't very good at it. Maybe if you'd like we can look at the league results from October through November and you can point out the differences betweeen a team set out to draw and the team that achieved 7 of them in a row.

Your fear is no longer my concern, the facts don't back you up, you're own argument doesn't back you up and your anti-Mancini skewing threshold is obvious and pathetic. Have your say, I am sure it will make perfect sense to you, but for someone who isn't anti-Mancini, how come you keep having to ram your fears down everyone else's throats? Please reply, it really does prove the point.

Come on guys lets not start falling out,all this thread is about is to guage your feelings if we miss out on the Champs league.

Slim wrote:

Original Dub wrote:Strange question.... it was 4-2 to us mate.

Doesn't mean we didn't look like we set up purely to not let them score, as we have done against all the top sides. It worked that time, how? I don't know, but it hasn't worked any other time and you think I'm being negative purely because I'm fearful we'll do it again?

Remind me, what was the league result against Everton, Liverpool & U***d?

This is a cool game.

So we were set up to to draw against a team that hadn't lost at home in god knows how long, a team that not only hasn't lost a single home game this season but only got one draw and we scored 4, outplayed them and should have won 4-1 if it wasn't for that fucking ref giving away penalties like pennies.

I'd like to know why you choose top8 as your threshold and not top 6 considering that's who we have to play, or even top 10 if you wanted to separate the better teams in the league from the chaff. Wait, it's so you can avoid the fact we beat 9th and 10th, battered 9th in fact and if you go top 6, our record is w1, d1, l1.

Either way, if we include Everton we get w1 d1 l3 and if you include 10th, we get w3 d1 l3. In fact if you take all 17 games into account, we get w10 d3 l4. Hardly a team looking to draw matches is it? Maybe they are in fact looking to draw games, but aren't very good at it. Maybe if you'd like we can look at the league results from October through November and you can point out the differences betweeen a team set out to draw and the team that achieved 7 of them in a row.

Your fear is no longer my concern, the facts don't back you up, you're own argument doesn't back you up and your anti-Mancini skewing threshold is obvious and pathetic. Have your say, I am sure it will make perfect sense to you, but for someone who isn't anti-Mancini, how come you keep having to ram your fears down everyone else's throats? Please reply, it really does prove the point.

I'm not giving reasons that we will lose a game, I giving reasons to explain my aprehension, which is why you started at me in the first place.

And if you're uber confident going into these tough games, then well done, but either your lying or you are basing your confidence on our ability to trash shit teams.

Now if you want to put me in a box and call me "anti-Mancini" I really couldn't give a fuck - you obviously got good craic out of the two divided camps during hughes' time here - whatever makes you feel better, but in the cold light of day, stats and head to head form is measured on how you have faired of late and against that particular opposition in the past, so I think I've every right to be aprehensive.

Just like you had every right to be aprehensive about our games in hand when it suited your obvious agenda at the time.

The only difference here is that I want Mancini to succeed. I think he has some very good qualities as a coach and I certainly don't want to see him sacked needlessly. I also think he's a likeable bloke with a very good record in another country.
But I will air my concerns over some of his decision making if I see fit. Because I like to think I have a good grasp on the game of football, as I'm sure you think you do.

The fact you have absolutely NO CONCERNS is a little bit shady if you ask me.

Then again, you didn't... ask me that is.

btajim wrote:

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:

Original Dub wrote:
Just out of interest - are you very confident we'll secure fourth and if not, why not?

I'm not and it's mostly down to super form of Tottenham, easy fixtures Villa have left and tough fixture list we have left. I reckon we'll finish 6th.

Villa have easy games left, NQDP? They've got to come to City. Nothing easy about that! *cough*

6th?! Would you give Mancini another season if he guides us to 6th?

Whether I would or wouldn't give him another season is irrelevant. That's down to owners. For what it's worth (not much) I have seen Mancini transform our play and with couple of additions in summer and ability to moukd this into his own team I reckon he could guide us to top4 next season and depending on players e get, maybe even be on the mix for the title to some degree (although I think next season is too early no matter who is in charge).

6th, 5th same difference for me really. What was THE most important thing for me this season was that we showed we are capable of proper challenge for top 4. At one stage of the season we were slipping behind but fought our way back and with four games to go we are in the mix.

crossan wrote:Come on guys lets not start falling out,all this thread is about is to guage your feelings if we miss out on the Champs league.

Good point C
getting back on track - missing out on 4th - I'll be feeling sick, very fucking pissed off, be a grumpy cnut.
Then also be well chuffed we got 5th and europe.