Kneeling

[City64]

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Brilliant pal .

[PrezIke]

Sad that we're not listening to one another instead of treating others views like their worthless and telling others how they should reply in order for it to be treated with respect or even read.

I'll keep it civil and say, told you so as to why I kept my mouth shut.

Sad, but is what it is.

This is exactly why minority voices tend to be silent.

[PrezIke]

Just to clarify, how this became exclusively about Maine Road feels like a total distraction, a way to avoid answering my points, spin away from it entirely and effectively silence my point (remember Mase, you decided it was you who decided how many words I can use) and make it about my so-called ignorance knowing I haven't been there.

If you decide that means I have no real say in the conversation I don't think the issue is me.

Peace and respect, but I'm calling it as I see it.

[Mase]

Sad that we're not listening to one another instead of treating others views like their worthless and telling others how they should reply in order for it to be treated with respect or even read.

I'll keep it civil and say, told you so as to why I kept my mouth shut.

Sad, but is what it is.

This is exactly why minority voices tend to be silent.

Are you taking the piss?! No one knows what colour your skin is or what race you are on the fuckin internet!! You’re being treated the way you are because you’re comparing 90s England with the US. YOU literally said “nah you can’t have had that experience because others might not have had that experience” without ever going to Maine Road.

You can’t see your arse now and blame it on “minorities not having a voice”

[Mase]

Peace and respect, but I'm calling it as I see it.

How can you call it as you see it when you’re not in England?

It’s the equivalent of someone saying to me “what about France, bad isn’t it there?” How would I know?!

[Blue Jam]

Bravo Millwall and QPR
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55239475

[Mase]

Bravo Millwall and QPR
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55239475

KickItOut is great (on the banner). They actually do stuff in the community and try to educate.

That’s the difference. Let’s not be sheep and just follow America doing a meaningless kneel.

[City64]

Sad that we're not listening to one another instead of treating others views like their worthless and telling others how they should reply in order for it to be treated with respect or even read.

I'll keep it civil and say, told you so as to why I kept my mouth shut.

Sad, but is what it is.

This is exactly why minority voices tend to be silent.

Mate the whole thread has been civil chill out . It’s just the fact that back in the day Maine rd was unique and City fans are proud of that so City fans from that era will frown on your comment pal . None of us on here would comment on the situation in New York on the difficult issue as we don’t have a fucking clue how the community fabric of New York works or how diverse it is etc . No bad feelings over the misunderstanding pal , up the fucking blues !

[PrezIke]

Sad that we're not listening to one another instead of treating others views like their worthless and telling others how they should reply in order for it to be treated with respect or even read.

I'll keep it civil and say, told you so as to why I kept my mouth shut.

Sad, but is what it is.

This is exactly why minority voices tend to be silent.

Are you taking the piss?! No one knows what colour your skin is or what race you are on the fuckin internet!! You’re being treated the way you are because you’re comparing 90s England with the US. YOU literally said “nah you can’t have had that experience because others might not have had that experience” without ever going to Maine Road.

You can’t see your arse now and blame it on “minorities not having a voice”

Taking the piss? Definitely not and I mean that sincerely.

You said there was nothing political happening in games at Main Road, according to you. I disagreed.

I explained why I disagreed and pointed to others who have been there who have or would disagree.

Simples.

We must be misunderstanding one another. I mean minorities as not just people who are black or brown.

Minorities as in NOT the majority.

As a Yank on here I think that puts me solidly in the minority. I am not able to say I attended Maine Road so that additionally makes me a minority.

If you use Yank English or spelling on here you are 100% going to have someone take the piss out of you if they are simply being kind at least, so I have to make sure I adapt. I do it, and it's not terrible but it is about me changing to suit the majority. Go ask Pep who I just heard start pronouncing Sergio's name as if he were a native English speaker.

That's what happens when you're not the majority. The expectation of assimilation or pay a price socially and maybe worse. That's the point about what happens at games across the world.

I have an opinion that I am saying FEELS to me like (not saying IS WHAT YOU INTENDED) not choosing to treat me in a respectful manner.

Dictating the terms suitable to you to explain my views, which certain comes across like an attempt to belittle, as if a reading few extra sentences is somehow a legitimate problem, and turning the topic into what happened exclusively at Maine Road.

That's MY feeling and opinion. I'd hope it matters a little bit. If not, I can't change anyone's mind if one doesn't want to be open. I like to think it doesn't have to be a pissing contest.

I am and have been wrong on many things. I will admit that.

[Mase]

“turning the topic into what happened exclusively at Maine Road.”

Are you on drugs?! I gave an example of my childhood going to watch City at Maine Road. We were already talking about Maine Road when you entered the chat. We’re talking about Maine Road and England exclusively because guess what, we’re talking and the English Premier League. We’re not talking about MLS, or any other countries league. We’re talking about Manchester City and the Premier League.

Why you acting soft now? You’ve followed me around the board writing shitty essays for weeks, and now you’ve been shown up you’re looking for sympathy because people have called you out - and doing the most horrible thing of saying “my view as a minority isn’t valued”. Again, no one knows anything about you.

[PrezIke]

Sad that we're not listening to one another instead of treating others views like their worthless and telling others how they should reply in order for it to be treated with respect or even read.

I'll keep it civil and say, told you so as to why I kept my mouth shut.

Sad, but is what it is.

This is exactly why minority voices tend to be silent.

Mate the whole thread has been civil chill out . It’s just the fact that back in the day Maine rd was unique and City fans are proud of that so City fans from that era will frown on your comment pal . None of us on here would comment on the situation in the New York on the difficult issue as we don’t have a fucking clue how the community fabric of New York works or how diverse it is etc . No bad feelings over the misunderstanding pal , up the fucking blues !

Respect mate, I hear you.

I acknowledge I have NO IDEA what happened, first hand, at Maine Road and if it feels that I am diminishing your views, I do not wish to do that.

However, if I point to others who have, as I did, why does that not count?

Also, I have been to football matches in England and I heard and saw similar behaviour. Also, there are more than enough incidents at English football matches we know of involving politics.

General behaviour at sporting events is not THAT different in some ways across the globe, especially when it comes to whoever the majority is in the stadiums, which are almost always straight men other than less popular and women's sport.

I was explaining this and showing examples.

All good. Up the blues indeed.

[PrezIke]

Just lastly, and I do want to stop and again don't wish to fight at all as I have a lot of respect and admiration for everyone here.

Why is it okay to critique me as not being in England/English on this or not having been to Maine Road but then flip roles when discussing BLM or kneeling against racism?

For those partaking in supporting those views/actions wouldn't it be that those, especially black and brown people, feel that those who are white and boo, or say it doesn't matter can't understand what they feel?

Just asking.

I do get that for those who are white who boo, I believe the sense for some is they are under attack. Perhaps I am wrong.

[Mase]

For those partaking in supporting those views/actions wouldn't it be that those, especially black and brown people, feel that those who are white and boo, or say it doesn't matter can't understand what they feel?
.

Just out of interest, who told you it was white people booing? Genuinely interest. How do you not know it was Asian people who are sick of the kneeling? Why are you choosing to discriminate against white people without knowing facts?

And this is my point. One races is being told they’ve done something without any facts. Would that have happened if the kneeling wasn’t going on? It’s bringing more problems and educating no one.

[Guy Debord]

All of these people claiming that Maine road Inthe 70s, 80s and 80s was some kind of colour blind utopia are fucking delusional.

I don't believe anyone who regularly attended can't have heard racist comments towards black players, hissing at Tottenham, sexism the list goes on. It was commonplace at football back then and to deny that is to lie.

My memory of Maine road was of the crowd being predominantly white despite being in an extremely multicultural area. This was highlighted when city played a friendly against Jamaica and the locals actually did show up. I was shocked at the demographic shift. Why didn't black moss siders attend the league games?

The feeling that those old entrenched views are suppressed and exist just below the surface has been made clear by many recent incidents including racism towards Sterling both by opposition and (unbelievably) our own fans and the fucking abject behaviour of Millwall mouth breathers.

Booing a gesture intended to bring about an end to racism is as low as football fans have got in a long time and this 'Marxist' bullshit is a fragile defence.

If I was black and took my kids to a game and saw that I wouldn't be going back.

I can only hope that the keyboard warriors on here won't be in attendance when we go back to the Etihad as I don't want to see the club's name associated (against the club's will) with this kind of regressive behaviour.

Here's some recollections by fans for the hard of remembering: https://www.theguardian.com/observer/sp ... 55,00.html

[PrezIke]

For those partaking in supporting those views/actions wouldn't it be that those, especially black and brown people, feel that those who are white and boo, or say it doesn't matter can't understand what they feel?
.

Just out of interest, who told you it was white people booing? Genuinely interest. How do you not know it was Asian people who are sick of the kneeling? Why are you choosing to discriminate against white people without knowing facts?

And this is my point. One races is being told they’ve done something without any facts. Would that have happened if the kneeling wasn’t going on? It’s bringing more problems and educating no one.

So we need a head count to know this? Come on now mate. You know that it is overwhelming majority going to be whites. Millwall has a bad reputation and I haven't heard one peep about any real number being anything other than white.

Of those on here who have a problem with the kneeling, are most white or not?

Is there going to be some people of colour who do? Of course.

Some Asians do tend to hold different views on race, I am well aware, yes. However, they also don't share the same experiences in school and with law enforcement as a group compared to other groups.

There are ALWAYS exceptions to everything, but anecdotal evidence is like saying, I know someone who wore a seatbelt and didn't die whilst driving to work so it therefore must be okay to not wear a seatbelt when driving.

Does that sound right?

[Harry Dowd scored]

For those partaking in supporting those views/actions wouldn't it be that those, especially black and brown people, feel that those who are white and boo, or say it doesn't matter can't understand what they feel?
.

Just out of interest, who told you it was white people booing? Genuinely interest. How do you not know it was Asian people who are sick of the kneeling? Why are you choosing to discriminate against white people without knowing facts?

And this is my point. One races is being told they’ve done something without any facts. Would that have happened if the kneeling wasn’t going on? It’s bringing more problems and educating no one.

Apparently the crowd cheered when the players linked arms against racism tonight, proof the boing was against the very dubious BLM movement, which preach defund the police among other far left whack job policy’s

[Mase]

Booing a gesture intended to bring about an end to racism is as low as football fans have got in a long time and this 'Marxist' bullshit is a fragile defence.

How is it bringing an end to racism. I look forward to this one. More importantly, how is Colin Kazim-Richards doing a Black Power salute not adding to the problem?

I’ve seen the ridiculous term White Power associated with BNP, EDL, Nazi’s. So what is the difference with someone doing a Black Power salute? Surely you can see that adds more tension than anything?!!

[PrezIke]

All of these people claiming that Maine road Inthe 70s, 80s and 80s was some kind of colour blind utopia are fucking delusional.

I don't believe anyone who regularly attended can't have heard racist comments towards black players, hissing at Tottenham, sexism the list goes on. It was commonplace at football back then and to deny that is to lie.

My memory of Maine road was of the crowd being predominantly white despite being in an extremely multicultural area. This was highlighted when city played a friendly against Jamaica and the locals actually did show up. I was shocked at the demographic shift. Why didn't black moss siders attend the league games?

The feeling that those old entrenched views are suppressed and exist just below the surface has been made clear by many recent incidents including racism towards Sterling both by opposition and (unbelievably) our own fans and the fucking abject behaviour of Millwall mouth breathers.

Booing a gesture intended to bring about an end to racism is as low as football fans have got in a long time and this 'Marxist' bullshit is a fragile defence.

If I was black and took my kids to a game and saw that I wouldn't be going back.

I can only hope that the keyboard warriors on here won't be in attendance when we go back to the Etihad as I don't want to see the club's name associated (against the club's will) with this kind of regressive behaviour.

Cheers for chiming in.

I'm unfortunately not surprised to hear this and figured I was not completely mental as this behaviour is too commonplace at sport events in many locations.

Racism has become more coded, and in some sports the fans have changed and what is allowed to be expressed has changed but underneath I do believe we are seeing the built up frustrations being expressed by whites who themselves feel marginalized by challenges to traditional components of white, straight, male dominance that led to the rise of Brexit and the likes of Trump here in the States.

Btw, for others reading...

Being white, straight and male does not automatically make you a bad person to many who support BLM.

I do believe that some on the very far left who feel highly marginalized can also take on aspects of silencing different views (i.e. true believers in Critical Race Theory) and whilst I can see why, I find it problematic and as possibly emulating behaviour of "the oppressor".

[Guy Debord]

Booing a gesture intended to bring about an end to racism is as low as football fans have got in a long time and this 'Marxist' bullshit is a fragile defence.

How is it bringing an end to racism. I look forward to this one. More importantly, how is Colin Kazim-Richards doing a Black Power salute not adding to the problem?

I’ve seen the ridiculous term White Power associated with BNP, EDL, Nazi’s. So what is the difference with someone doing a Black Power salute? Surely you can see that adds more tension than anything?!!

If you can't tell the difference between white power and black power I'm fucked if I can teach you. Read a book

[City64]

All of these people claiming that Maine road Inthe 70s, 80s and 80s was some kind of colour blind utopia are fucking delusional.

I don't believe anyone who regularly attended can't have heard racist comments towards black players, hissing at Tottenham, sexism the list goes on. It was commonplace at football back then and to deny that is to lie.

My memory of Maine road was of the crowd being predominantly white despite being in an extremely multicultural area. This was highlighted when city played a friendly against Jamaica and the locals actually did show up. I was shocked at the demographic shift. Why didn't black moss siders attend the league games?

The feeling that those old entrenched views are suppressed and exist just below the surface has been made clear by many recent incidents including racism towards Sterling both by opposition and (unbelievably) our own fans and the fucking abject behaviour of Millwall mouth breathers.

Booing a gesture intended to bring about an end to racism is as low as football fans have got in a long time and this 'Marxist' bullshit is a fragile defence.

If I was black and took my kids to a game and saw that I wouldn't be going back.

I can only hope that the keyboard warriors on here won't be in attendance when we go back to the Etihad as I don't want to see the club's name associated (against the club's will) with this kind of regressive behaviour.

Here's some recollections by fans for the hard of remembering: https://www.theguardian.com/observer/sp ... 55,00.html

Delusional ?
A large percentage of City,s away support was “black” in the 80s FACT !