What the hell has happened to my beloved club?

[Murph]

Steven Gerrard is a fan favourite Liverpool player. He loves the club to bits and gives his all for them.
Stephen Ireland is a fan favourite Man City player. He loves the club to bits and gives his all for them.

Steven Gerrard had a world class season in 2008/09
Stephen Ireland had a world class season in 2008/09

Steven Gerrard played like pants at the start of 2009/10
Stephen Ireland played like pants at the start of 2009/10

Steven Gerrard was retained in the first team because the club believes in his ability and that he'll return to form.
Stephen Ireland was dropped, given bit part sub roles, not included in the European squad and told to fuck off to Aston Villa.


Thats the difference for me in how players who have proven themselves in the past for the club should be handled. And unfortunately Dunne was the same story. And in fact Bellamy and Given appear to be the same and those two haven't even done anything wrong apart from not be English it seems.

If you think there's no room for sentiment in football, fair enough. But if the club shows so little compassion to their players as that then Man City is royally fucked if they don't get Top 4 this season because they'll get none back from the players.

Do you believe Ireland is on a par with Gerard as a player? Btw Onuoha is English and he's been moved on, and once Milner signs he will be the first English player signed this Summer out of 6 major signings, that's hardly showing favouritism to English players in my book.

[DoomMerchant]

Fucks sake go and support Blackpool if your such a masochist!

Do you want to win things or not?

Give it 3 seasons and the normal will be us winning everything. Just like U***d have to decades now. Have they lost their heart and soul (go along with me)

Our clubs soul will be one of winners. Get ready for change

To be fair i have 2 close friends who are rags, Enlishmen in their 50s who know proper football and are great fans. It can happen. At some level some of them just happen to support a team from the northwest and enjoy proper football and you can have a great conversation with them. They remember the times before the glory and are appreciative of everything they've won because they remember life before filling the cupboard every season.

I don't need a tin hat. I hope most City fans come off like they do if we are fortunate and hardworking enough to win a lot of shit.

Cheers

[Beefymcfc]

Fucks sake go and support Blackpool if your such a masochist!

Do you want to win things or not?

Give it 3 seasons and the normal will be us winning everything. Just like U***d have to decades now. Have they lost their heart and soul (go along with me)

Our clubs soul will be one of winners. Get ready for change

Now your just getting boring. This forum isn't full of unsuspecting people trying to prove they are City fans (although that is what you want in a certain way), it is a forum for well meaning sensible people who just want to talk about our club. Whether you meant your OP in a way to wind people up or not (I think the latter), your attitude now just strikes of taking the piss of those that you pronounce to have an allegiance with.

Nice one pal, I'll remember that all Blues are not the same and that some can just go and get to fuck.

[gillie]

In fairness prior to that season Ireland was under 21 so its not like he'd have been expected to do anything spectacular then.

The point is he showed a lot of ability and potential in his time prior to last season, like serious ability and was rewarded with contract after contract to reflect this and keep him at city for as long as possible.
He wound up overworking himself pre-season, got a series of injuries, was played mostly out of position, and seemed to be unsettled by the sacking of Hughes. There are reasons there as to why he wasn't at his best last season. But the bottom line is he deserved another season at least to show what he can do and get back to where he was. He's still young and learning, didn't deserve this.

At 21 Pele was on his way to 2 World Cup winners medals Why? Because he was class and had the ability to rise above his surroundings and become great.Ireland just not have the mentality of a winner imo whereas Milner does.

[lythamblue]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

[Kladze]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

By the way, how the fuck did Pele get into this thread? :-D

[Bear60]

Stop moaning, if you want to win things, this is the only way to catch up and do it.

Lets win some meaningful trophies, and THEN start worrying about our image etc.

Do you think any other club given, say, 1 Billion pounds to spend, would do things any other way?

Do you think we deserve some success after all we have been through?

I fucking do, and I dont give a shit how to we do it, I want us to be the best club in the world.

Ireland and Bellers would not be regular players for the 4 other teams "bigger" than us at the moment. Therefore they're not good enough for us. Sure Bellers is brill, winners attitude, but he is flawed by being a cunt, and being injured to much, we cant carry player like that, we dont have to anymore.

Our owner has a winners mentality. City fans do not. We need to get use to it quickly

Top post,

I have followed City since 1968 so I am one of the lucky ones that remember the good old days , and that is what they were good old days , since then we have had nothing but heartache and pain and have been ridiculed relentlessly by other fans. Times have changed and if you dont move with the times like in all aspects of life you dont get anywhere. This is our time now so chill out and sit back and enjoy the party.

[lythamblue]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

I'm not saying we are dishonest. But we are not exactly everyone's favourite second club any more are we?

[gillie]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

By the way, how the fuck did Pele get into this thread? :-D

I made the comparison about Pele regarding Ireland/Milner as i thought one has a winning mentality and the other does'nt.But hey lets go back 11 years and think where were we then the likes of York,Oldham and fuckin Grimsby yeah lets get that back and recover our soul.

[Kladze]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

I'm not saying we are dishonest. But we are not exactly everyone's favourite second club any more are we?

True.

Do you care?

[lythamblue]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

I'm not saying we are dishonest. But we are not exactly everyone's favourite second club any more are we?

True.

Do you care?

No ..... not any more. Let's try it the other way.

I would love to have the conversation in 10 years time as to whether we enjoyed the last 10 years more than the next 10 years.

I look forward to that thread! I can see the thread title now :

"Honest Joes or Multiple European Champions .... which did you prefer?"

[Kladze]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

I'm not saying we are dishonest. But we are not exactly everyone's favourite second club any more are we?

True.

Do you care?

No ..... not any more. Let's try it the other way.

I would love to have the conversation in 10 years time as to whether we enjoyed the last 10 years more than the next 10 years.

I look forward to that thread! I can see the thread title now :

"Honest Joes or Multiple European Champions .... which did you prefer?"

That's if we haven't jossed it by then through over excitement ;-)

[ThisIsOurCity]

Sorry its not the same club that I have been following since 1964,they treat players like Bellamy and Ireland abismally,we have so many glory hunters suddenly becoming City fans its a joke................Joe Mercer and Albert Alexander must be turning in their graves,its not Manchester City as I have known it,it pains me to say that it really does,we are unrecognisable,paying ridiculous transfer fees and wages to unproven players Ballotelli for example,I am at a loss to comprehend the terrible thought that 'my club' no longer exists.

You're not Colin Shindler are you ? You're rhetoric seems eerily familiar.
Bellamy has been treated more than fairly in my opinion and Ireland, sadly,
has failed to fulfil the potential he showed a couple of seasons ago and
has been moved on. Happens all the time in football when players don't
make the grade.

The only thing annoying me about City at the moment is "fans" like you who
seem to want to drag us back to the times when we were a comedy club and
knew our place. Well, our place has thankfully been elevated and at long last
we can actually see progress upwards rather than downwards. You don't like it
the solution is simple, support a struggling team with no money to spend and
run by a bunch of well meaning but inept shopkeepers.

You make the point that you've been following City since 1964, I attended my
first game in '68 so I know that you have experienced firsthand the kind of
amateurish business practices and poor management I'm talking about.
Whilst I'm all in favour of a little bit of blue tinted roses where nostalgia is
concerned I find it absolutely incredible that any City fan would want a return
to the not so good old days. Manchester City will always exist, it's your
ideal of it that doesn't exist anymore and even when it did it was only for
a very brief moment in our history.

[mcfc1632]

To me it is all quite simple.

I have spent over 30 years avidly supporting a Club who were perceived as everyone's second favourite club and something to feel sorry for. During that time, we have won next to nothing and I have jealously watched fans of other teams go to Cup finals and travel round Europe building some great experiences and memories they will treasure. I often ..... wished it was me!

So, we have tried to be 'honest Joes' for donkeys years and it has got us nowhere. Time to try it the other way methinks!

Ain't nothing dishonest about the way we're doing it now :-)

I'm not saying we are dishonest. But we are not exactly everyone's favourite second club any more are we?

...fucking good - only relentless losers get that sort of affection - fucking glad to leave it to West Ham, Everton etc

[mcfc1632]

Sorry its not the same club that I have been following since 1964,they treat players like Bellamy and Ireland abismally,we have so many glory hunters suddenly becoming City fans its a joke................Joe Mercer and Albert Alexander must be turning in their graves,its not Manchester City as I have known it,it pains me to say that it really does,we are unrecognisable,paying ridiculous transfer fees and wages to unproven players Ballotelli for example,I am at a loss to comprehend the terrible thought that 'my club' no longer exists.

You're not Colin Shindler are you ? You're rhetoric seems eerily familiar.
Bellamy has been treated more than fairly in my opinion and Ireland, sadly,
has failed to fulfil the potential he showed a couple of seasons ago and
has been moved on. Happens all the time in football when players don't
make the grade.

The only thing annoying me about City at the moment is "fans" like you who
seem to want to drag us back to the times when we were a comedy club and
knew our place. Well, our place has thankfully been elevated and at long last
we can actually see progress upwards rather than downwards. You don't like it
the solution is simple, support a struggling team with no money to spend and
run by a bunch of well meaning but inept shopkeepers.

You make the point that you've been following City since 1964, I attended my
first game in '68 so I know that you have experienced firsthand the kind of
amateurish business practices and poor management I'm talking about.
Whilst I'm all in favour of a little bit of blue tinted roses where nostalgia is
concerned I find it absolutely incredible that any City fan would want a return
to the not so good old days. Manchester City will always exist, it's your
ideal of it that doesn't exist anymore and even when it did it was only for
a very brief moment in our history.

well done - very articulate and I am sure conveying the views of many of us

[Kyle]

When you strip out the key players and fan favourites from any club, change the entire buying philosophy, manager, the youth policy, the owners, allow the fanbase to change dramatically. What exactly are you supporting anymore? A pile of players with no connection or loyalty to the team or tradition of the club pulling on the sky blue shirt purely because they're being paid 100's of thousands to do so?

I mean how much can you change in a club before you take away the very things people loved the club for in the first place?

My sentiments exactly.

[Michigan Blue]

When you strip out the key players and fan favourites from any club,

Rewind three years, first derby double in 38 years...who were truly the "key players" and "fan favourites"? If I'm not mistaken none of them were named Craig Bellamy, and two of them featured for us at WHL this past Saturday.

change the entire buying philosophy,

We're loaded now. Shall we return to the halcyon days of splashing out for Benjani, Samaras, Mills, etc.?

manager,

How far back would you go to find a manager preferable to Mancini? Not having a go, I'm honestly curious.

the youth policy,

For a manager who has not had to promote academy lads out of desperation, it's pretty hard to fault Bobby's youth policy.

the owners,

Swales is dead, shall we bring back Thaksin?

allow the fanbase to change dramatically.

Has it? Our profile is bigger now, but we've still won nowt. Got my first chance to meet fellow overseas Blues last month in Baltimore, and could not find a knuckledragging glory-hunter among them. All very humble, hopeful, and knowledgeable.

[Manx Blue]

Sorry its not the same club that I have been following since 1964,they treat players like Bellamy and Ireland abismally,we have so many glory hunters suddenly becoming City fans its a joke................Joe Mercer and Albert Alexander must be turning in their graves,its not Manchester City as I have known it,it pains me to say that it really does,we are unrecognisable,paying ridiculous transfer fees and wages to unproven players Ballotelli for example,I am at a loss to comprehend the terrible thought that 'my club' no longer exists.

Just listening to the Blue Tuesday Podcast....you got a mention Crossan

[BobbyJ1956]

Yes, sure, Crosssan's moan strikes a chord but with people who get nostalgic about when City played with the Manchester crest on their shirts and good old Joe Mercer would pop out to the cafe across the street for a bacon butty. My first City game was in 1955 so I'm one one of them. But times change, life changes, and when it comes down to it the posts that make most sense on here are the ones by Sister of Fu and Lytham. Soul went out of football when the Premiership and Sky started up and there's no finding it again unless you watch Rochdale or Accrington Stanley. I've just come back from three weeks in Lancashire, seeing my dad who's 90 and not got long left, and he wants to see City win something again, so let's support the manager and the chairman and support the team Mancini is trying to build with the millions he's been given. I reckon Joe Mercer and Albert Alexander would be thrilled to bits to see City champions of England again so my hope is that Nora and Big Mal and Bert Trautmann too will all be there to walk out onto the pitch the day Carlos Tevez holds up the trophy next May.

[Cityfan]

Seems to me there are two aspects to Crossans complaint
1) we are spending more money than is good.
2) We should not be treating ireland / Bellamy so badly and this is atypical of City.

The first complaint I have some sympathy with in as much as I personally think fooball was better for not being so money dominated an delatively small teams could with good management genuinely challenge the top teams. I have been supporting City and following football since the late sixties and it was fascinating and worthwhile seeing the rise and sometimes fall f clubs like QPR Derby Forrest Ipswich Villa and Everton with smaller budgets than the bigger teams. It is a shame to me that those days have gone but they have and we are not the cause of it.
Football is now dominated far more by moneywhich is uforunate but in this situation I am absolutely delighted that my club now has it. Yes we are lucky to have it but it is certainly no less honest a way of acquiring wealth than by delibarately creating a cartel to exclude your rivals as Rags Pool and Arsenal did when they joined the G14.

The second complaint is a bit of an unrealistic look at any club including City good and bad footballers always leave for ones the manager percieves are better/less disruptive or if you are poor more affordable.
From a footballing point of view I think Ireland may well benefit from leaving City last season his performances did not just fall below the very high standards he had set the previous season but fell well below what he was doing the season before. For whatever reaon he just did not look interested. He is a fine talent and I hope he rediscovers form at Villa but moving him on is not exactly unreasonable. Personally I think Bellamy could do a job and would keep him but the manager obviously disagrees Bellamy in all his interviews does not express any dissatisfation by CIty's treatment, quite the opposite.
To think that getting rid of players who have previously done well or been good trainees is a new thing and untypical of City is patently absurd to anyone with a memory.
Players have left because we think we can get better ones they are unaffordable or are not good enough. The managers have soetimes been right but often wrong.
Does noone remember Lee, Quinn, Owen. Barnes, Power, Bishop, Flitcroft, Flood, Jordan, Croft either Wright-Phillips, White, Caton, Dickov, Goater, Hughes(winger not manager), Lomas, Hendry etc etc.