The hughes Thread

[Im_Spartacus]

I only parially agree with that John as i don't think it was a bad a picture as you are painting but you are right in the fact that we fell short on many occasion under Hughes. I considered that to be normal and believed as time went on, it would slowly change for the better.

No you're right, its not as bad as I am painting it, there were other games we played reasonably well in - but what some clung onto as optimism that he was the right chap for the job - the sensational performances where we tore sides apart, I looked on it as a negative that we were clearly capable, but ultimately flattered to decieve in that more often than not we played very very badly and went down without a fight. This season, I will credit him for instilling a fighting spirit in the team, but on the flip side, you shouldnt have to fight to draw level in every game when you have this talent at our disposal.

I actually thought the opposite to you - in terms of it getting better, as I felt that what Hughes did well, was coming out of the blocks at the start of the season and unleashing a surprise. He did it both seasons, but as we got to the end of the 2nd months of the season both times, the wheels fell off as the other managers tactically out-thought him, and motivated their players to outfight ours. He didnt seem to have the answer to this

I liked him as a bloke, I liked him with the press, I generally liked him & respect his standing in the game and still do now, but he is an inept tactician, a problem compounded by seemingly struggling to motivating the team consistently. This was the only reason why I ever felt negative towards Hughes and I think is a fair assessment of the situation.

If he could have overcome either one of the tactical or the motivation issue, he would still be here now and I would be right behind him

[Im_Spartacus]

Reading this thread makes me wonder if people over the previous 18 months had been watching a different team.

Hughes attacking and cavalier style is a total and utter myth. We had a run of form from West Ham(h) Sunderland (a), Pompey (h) early last season where we won 3 games convincingly in short space of time. We attacked well vs Liverpool despite the defeat, and for the rest of the season we turned in 5 noteworthy performances, vs Stoke, Arsenal, Hull, Hamburg at home and Schalke away.

That is a season of 8 maybe 9 good ATTACKING performances amongst a total of 56 games. Have people forgotten about Midgetland, Copenhagen, Aalborg, Brighton, WIgan, Bolton, Middlsborough, West Brom, Spurs, Forest, Pompey, West Ham, Fulham, which are vying for positions as the most spineless, impotent displays from any Manchester CIty side in history?

No, if they had they'd've posted stuff like 'every game under Hughes was wonderful from the moment he came' but they haven't have they? No one's said anything in huge praise of him really have they? Nor has anyone said he's the worlds greatest manager or anything like that. In fact all anyone's said, as far as I can see, is that some were enjoying the football better. I should imagine that is based mainly on this season too. Even so, the same people who've spent 2 seasons slaughtering him are turning up one by one to tell anyone that did enjoy his football, how they were wrong to do so & actually they weren't really entertained at all, they're either lying or they just imagined it, presumably because they all loved him so much & were blinded by his ex rag rugged persona.

The point is that out of 56 games last season, 8 or 9 of them were good examples of a decent style of football. The remainder, particularly away from home were much the same as we have now, not particularly entertaining, more often than not totally ineffective, showing little heart and fight

The difference to Mancini is that we knew that Hughes' side had it in them to turn in a good performance, wheras with the current manager we have little evidence that this is the case - this for me often made it all the more frustrating when we played poorly. It seemed as though the good performances came about so rarely, they could almost be described as blips in what was otherwise a horrendous catalogue of insipid performances and displays.

I am not trying to re-write history with what I am saying, it is a fact that our style of play under Hughes stunk the majority of the time.

Admittedly it now stinks most of the time also............. :o(

You're right, a lot of what we played last season wasn't the football we are refferring to. 56 games in one season is a lot for the strenght and quality of squad we had. I'm not sure its what Ted means, but from point of view, I could we were trying to play football in the right way and as time wore on and the squad improved in both quality and numbers, we were still playing football in the right way and had become the hardest team in Europe to beat. The only performance I felt completely deflated with was Spurs (which was exactly like the Evertone game under Roberto) and unlike many on here, I didn't view that run of draws as a "disgrace". I was unhappy with some of the results, but delighted with the draw away to wigan with ten men for so long, delighted with a point from Anfield and Villa Park, displeased with draw away at Bolton and pissed off with home draws against Fulham and Burnley, but it was no different than the run liverpool went on last season and they finished second.... overall though, the PERFORMANCES were pretty good even though we got sucker punched a few times.

This season I have enjoyed the football for 90% of hughes games and 10% of Mancini's games. The performances are different, the results reasonably similar, but as you say the second half against Chelsea has hopefully given us hope...

Every manager turns out shit games that don't represent the brand of football the club normally gives - ask Wenger for a long period last season - but IMO Hughes gave us the most attacking and exciting football I'd seen since Keegan in Div1 and I think we were heading in the right direction. Please God we still are, but all I want is some attacking football and a long term successful manager.

Is that too much to ask after all these years and all this money we have?!!

I'll be entirely consistent in my views on both then and now - we have proved under both Hughes and Mancini, that this team CAN play football, and I share your concern that having seen what it looked like vs Wolves, 2nd half vs Chelsea under Mancini, it leaves you begging for more, as we tore both teams a new arsehole when at our counter-attacking best. We know they can do it, and feel they are being restricted by a misguided tactical approach, which is down to the manager - I feel that applies to both Mancini and Hughes.

This was all my problem ever was with Hughes, that he had dangled the carrot with performances like Arsenal, Chelsea this season, Arsenal, Pompey, Hamburg last year, but these performances we just too isolated in the mediocrity when you looked at the big picture, which is why I believe the run of draws ultimately cost him.

If Mancini does the same, then he will have the same fate.

[Ted Hughes]

I only parially agree with that John as i don't think it was a bad a picture as you are painting but you are right in the fact that we fell short on many occasion under Hughes. I considered that to be normal and believed as time went on, it would slowly change for the better.

No you're right, its not as bad as I am painting it, there were other games we played reasonably well in - but what some clung onto as optimism that he was the right chap for the job - the sensational performances where we tore sides apart, I looked on it as a negative that we were clearly capable, but ultimately flattered to decieve in that more often than not we played very very badly and went down without a fight. This season, I will credit him for instilling a fighting spirit in the team, but on the flip side, you shouldnt have to fight to draw level in every game when you have this talent at our disposal.

I actually thought the opposite to you - in terms of it getting better, as I felt that what Hughes did well, was coming out of the blocks at the start of the season and unleashing a surprise. He did it both seasons, but as we got to the end of the 2nd months of the season both times, the wheels fell off as the other managers tactically out-thought him, and motivated their players to outfight ours. He didnt seem to have the answer to this

I liked him as a bloke, I liked him with the press, I generally liked him & respect his standing in the game and still do now, but he is an inept tactician, a problem compounded by seemingly struggling to motivating the team consistently. This was the only reason why I ever felt negative towards Hughes and I think is a fair assessment of the situation.

If he could have overcome either one of the tactical or the motivation issue, he would still be here now and I would be right behind him

Two of our best performances, back to back, were just a few weeks before he was sacked though. If we're to believe Cook (which I don't incidentally, I think it's all about Mourinho) his fate was decided a fortnight later. That may seem reasonable to some here but doesn't to many outside City. There must have been about 20 occasions where Ferguson was in a similar position, up & down results wise, with a similarly expensive team for it's time, not yet having won the league, having failed from better positions with bigger expectations than ours for this season.

If Marwood was on a tv panel in his Sky days, discussing the sacking from an outside perspective, he would have been slaughtering us & saying we don't know what we're doing.

[john68]

Ted, Ra Hater is referring to me.
But in honesty, Mr Rag hater is being a cunt...He knows full well that his reference is out of context and is not the whole truth. He has deliberately missed out the significant points of that argument that qualified it.
He knows full well what was meant at the time. it was explained clearly and simply at the time, several times by a number of posters.
I have told him about doing this several times, yet once again Rag Hater has taken my words and twisted them into something that he knows wasn't not meant.

Cunt hey, charming.
I dont give a fuck what excuses and context you dreamt up to justify your ridiculous claim that clueless was the best manager in the world.The fact is you said it.The fact is as youv'e owned up to it and you have owned up to saying it again here and there were some daft enough to agree with you.

Not charming you cunt...honest....which is something you seem not to have any knowledge of. I stand by every word of my preceeding post...you are a cunt.
I am not interested whether you give a fuck or not as to whether you are a cunt. You can obviously read, so therefore you fully understood what was written at the time and was clearly explained to you in simple language during that debate. Therefore that makes you a lying cunt....whether you give a fuck or not.

The fact that you did what you did in the full knowledge of what you were doing makes you an evil lying cunt. You may quote or misquote that in any future threads. It doesn't need to be explained to you. Though you may wish to twist it to mean whatever you want it to.
Go fuck yourself.

[Im_Spartacus]

I only parially agree with that John as i don't think it was a bad a picture as you are painting but you are right in the fact that we fell short on many occasion under Hughes. I considered that to be normal and believed as time went on, it would slowly change for the better.

No you're right, its not as bad as I am painting it, there were other games we played reasonably well in - but what some clung onto as optimism that he was the right chap for the job - the sensational performances where we tore sides apart, I looked on it as a negative that we were clearly capable, but ultimately flattered to decieve in that more often than not we played very very badly and went down without a fight. This season, I will credit him for instilling a fighting spirit in the team, but on the flip side, you shouldnt have to fight to draw level in every game when you have this talent at our disposal.

I actually thought the opposite to you - in terms of it getting better, as I felt that what Hughes did well, was coming out of the blocks at the start of the season and unleashing a surprise. He did it both seasons, but as we got to the end of the 2nd months of the season both times, the wheels fell off as the other managers tactically out-thought him, and motivated their players to outfight ours. He didnt seem to have the answer to this

I liked him as a bloke, I liked him with the press, I generally liked him & respect his standing in the game and still do now, but he is an inept tactician, a problem compounded by seemingly struggling to motivating the team consistently. This was the only reason why I ever felt negative towards Hughes and I think is a fair assessment of the situation.

If he could have overcome either one of the tactical or the motivation issue, he would still be here now and I would be right behind him

Two of our best performances, back to back, were just a few weeks before he was sacked though. If we're to believe Cook (which I don't incidentally, I think it's all about Mourinho) his fate was decided a fortnight later. That may seem reasonable to some here but doesn't to many outside City. There must have been about 20 occasions where Ferguson was in a similar position, up & down results wise, with a similarly expensive team for it's time, not yet having won the league, having failed from better positions with bigger expectations than ours for this season.

If Marwood was on a tv panel in his Sky days, discussing the sacking from an outside perspective, he would have been slaughtering us & saying we don't know what we're doing.

I agree fully with you mate, the timing was bizarre and personally as concerned as I was, I would never have sacked him when we did - he had the rest of the season for me. In contrast, I'd have done it at the same stage last season without a second thought, as we were hurtling towards the bottom 3, but this season the club fucked up and dont seem to have thought it through very well.

I thought he was a limited manager, but also the club treated him appallingly, the club showed a total lack of class, and if we fail now will have brought total ridicule on ourselves, and the board will only have themselves to blame if this season goes pete tong and they start getting criticism from the fans

[Ted Hughes]

I only parially agree with that John as i don't think it was a bad a picture as you are painting but you are right in the fact that we fell short on many occasion under Hughes. I considered that to be normal and believed as time went on, it would slowly change for the better.

No you're right, its not as bad as I am painting it, there were other games we played reasonably well in - but what some clung onto as optimism that he was the right chap for the job - the sensational performances where we tore sides apart, I looked on it as a negative that we were clearly capable, but ultimately flattered to decieve in that more often than not we played very very badly and went down without a fight. This season, I will credit him for instilling a fighting spirit in the team, but on the flip side, you shouldnt have to fight to draw level in every game when you have this talent at our disposal.

I actually thought the opposite to you - in terms of it getting better, as I felt that what Hughes did well, was coming out of the blocks at the start of the season and unleashing a surprise. He did it both seasons, but as we got to the end of the 2nd months of the season both times, the wheels fell off as the other managers tactically out-thought him, and motivated their players to outfight ours. He didnt seem to have the answer to this

I liked him as a bloke, I liked him with the press, I generally liked him & respect his standing in the game and still do now, but he is an inept tactician, a problem compounded by seemingly struggling to motivating the team consistently. This was the only reason why I ever felt negative towards Hughes and I think is a fair assessment of the situation.

If he could have overcome either one of the tactical or the motivation issue, he would still be here now and I would be right behind him

Two of our best performances, back to back, were just a few weeks before he was sacked though. If we're to believe Cook (which I don't incidentally, I think it's all about Mourinho) his fate was decided a fortnight later. That may seem reasonable to some here but doesn't to many outside City. There must have been about 20 occasions where Ferguson was in a similar position, up & down results wise, with a similarly expensive team for it's time, not yet having won the league, having failed from better positions with bigger expectations than ours for this season.

If Marwood was on a tv panel in his Sky days, discussing the sacking from an outside perspective, he would have been slaughtering us & saying we don't know what we're doing.

I agree fully with you mate, the timing was bizarre and personally as concerned as I was, I would never have sacked him when we did - he had the rest of the season for me. In contrast, I'd have done it at the same stage last season without a second thought, as we were hurtling towards the bottom 3, but this season the club fucked up and dont seem to have thought it through very well.

I thought he was a limited manager, but also the club treated him appallingly, the club showed a total lack of class, and if we fail now will have brought total ridicule on ourselves, and the board will only have themselves to blame if this season goes pete tong and they start getting criticism from the fans

Would have made more sense last season & been less controversial. A win at weekend will put us right on track as regards top 4 though so the season could end brilliantly. Then I'll be interested to see whether they come out in public & immediately back Mancini if he gets us there. If they don't, we'll know what they're up to!

[Rag_hater]

Ted, Ra Hater is referring to me.
But in honesty, Mr Rag hater is being a cunt...He knows full well that his reference is out of context and is not the whole truth. He has deliberately missed out the significant points of that argument that qualified it.
He knows full well what was meant at the time. it was explained clearly and simply at the time, several times by a number of posters.
I have told him about doing this several times, yet once again Rag Hater has taken my words and twisted them into something that he knows wasn't not meant.

Cunt hey, charming.
I dont give a fuck what excuses and context you dreamt up to justify your ridiculous claim that clueless was the best manager in the world.The fact is you said it.The fact is as youv'e owned up to it and you have owned up to saying it again here and there were some daft enough to agree with you.

Not charming you cunt...honest....which is something you seem not to have any knowledge of. I stand by every word of my preceeding post...you are a cunt.
I am not interested whether you give a fuck or not as to whether you are a cunt. You can obviously read, so therefore you fully understood what was written at the time and was clearly explained to you in simple language during that debate. Therefore that makes you a lying cunt....whether you give a fuck or not.

The fact that you did what you did in the full knowledge of what you were doing makes you an evil lying cunt. You may quote or misquote that in any future threads. It doesn't need to be explained to you. Though you may wish to twist it to mean whatever you want it to.
Go fuck yourself.

Take some sedatives you old fool.
I remember you wriggling and making up all kinds of daft shit to explain why you had said the daft thing you did,thats what I remember
If your happy being a fool well carry on.Its no suprise you have to resort to abuse when your'e trying to deflect attention from the fact that youre a silly old sausage.
The simple language explained to me how daft you are.Nothing else.No matter what BS you come up with

[Im_Spartacus]

Would have made more sense last season & been less controversial. A win at weekend will put us right on track as regards top 4 though so the season could end brilliantly. Then I'll be interested to see whether they come out in public & immediately back Mancini if he gets us there. If they don't, we'll know what they're up to!

I suspect things could happen quite quickly which may lead to us announcing who will be the new manager for next season in the coming weeks. Inter going out of the cup could speed up that process, as clearly he would then be in a position to make a decision about whether he wanted the job or not.

[john68]

Much of the unrest within the club seem to have begun with the appointment of Brian Marwood.
Does anyone know what his job entails and just what power/seniority he had over hughes or has over Manciini?

Was his employement effectively a demotion for Hughes?

[Original Dub]

Anyone who thinks that it was CLEARLY said that Mark Hughes is the best manager in the world is a fucking retard.

Anyone who is saying this happened purely to wind up other posters should be ashamed of themselves.

I hate WUMs. I don't hate retards because its not their fault. Pick a side Raggers ;)

[The Man In Blue]

Take some sedatives you old fool.
I remember you wriggling and making up all kinds of daft shit to explain why you had said the daft thing you did,thats what I remember
If your happy being a fool well carry on.Its no suprise you have to resort to abuse when your'e trying to deflect attention from the fact that youre a silly old sausage.
The simple language explained to me how daft you are.Nothing else.No matter what BS you come up with

i don't normally go in for insulting posters but you are a fuckwit of the highest order old man.

quote me what john68 said that you are referring to. the very thing he said, not your bent paraphrasing of it.

[Rag_hater]

Anyone who thinks that it was CLEARLY said that Mark Hughes is the best manager in the world is a fucking retard.

Anyone who is saying this happened purely to wind up other posters should be ashamed of themselves.

I hate WUMs. I don't hate retards because its not their fault. Pick a side Raggers ;)

Is the Raggers said to wind me up.If thats the case do you hate yourself?
As I've said it does't really matter to me the reasons you or some people gave to state the fact that clueless was the best manager in the world(cos those reasons were the views of certain individuals)the fact is it was stated.And as you say anybody who said that is a retard.

[john68]

Come on Raggers...tell them the truth. The whole fuclin truth. The full context and the conditions put on the statement at the time.
Either that or crawl back inside your little rat hole.

This is your big moment to be reborn

[Rag_hater]

Take some sedatives you old fool.
I remember you wriggling and making up all kinds of daft shit to explain why you had said the daft thing you did,thats what I remember
If your happy being a fool well carry on.Its no suprise you have to resort to abuse when your'e trying to deflect attention from the fact that youre a silly old sausage.
The simple language explained to me how daft you are.Nothing else.No matter what BS you come up with

i don't normally go in for insulting posters but you are a fuckwit of the highest order old man.

quote me what john68 said that you are referring to. the very thing he said, not your bent paraphrasing of it.

Go and look for it yourself.
If you hadn't noticed Mr.68 admitted he said it so the need for me quoting him seems a futile.
But I suppose that would go over your head

[Original Dub]

Anyone who thinks that it was CLEARLY said that Mark Hughes is the best manager in the world is a fucking retard.

Anyone who is saying this happened purely to wind up other posters should be ashamed of themselves.

I hate WUMs. I don't hate retards because its not their fault. Pick a side Raggers ;)

Is the Raggers said to wind me up.If thats the case do you hate yourself?
As I've said it does't really matter to me the reasons you or some people gave to state the fact that clueless was the best manager in the world(cos those reasons were the views of certain individuals)the fact is it was stated.And as you say anybody who said that is a retard.

I NEVER said that, but that doesn't seem to matter to you sometimes.

And no, I wasn't trying to wind you up, I thought everyone called you raggers for short.

[Rag_hater]

Come on Raggers...tell them the truth. The whole fuclin truth. The full context and the conditions put on the statement at the time.
Either that or crawl back inside your little rat hole.

This is your big moment to be reborn

The truth was that you came up with all kinds of BS as to why YOU thought clueless was the best manager in the world

[The Man In Blue]

Go and look for it yourself.

spineless.

you attack someone for something they are supposed to have said, but when challenged to provide evidence you say "look for it yourself"? fucking hell man sort your head out.

you will not find is because you know you have made up bullshit, twisted someones words to fit your own arguments. now people have called your bluff you dont have a fucking clue what to do.

i say again: find me the exact quote of what you are alledging john to have said.

[Rag_hater]

Anyone who thinks that it was CLEARLY said that Mark Hughes is the best manager in the world is a fucking retard.
Anyone who is saying this happened purely to wind up other posters should be ashamed of themselves.

I hate WUMs. I don't hate retards because its not their fault. Pick a side Raggers ;)

You didn't say it then.
Was somebody else typing for you

[Rag_hater]

Go and look for it yourself.

spineless.

you attack someone for something they are supposed to have said, but when challenged to provide evidence you say "look for it yourself"? fucking hell man sort your head out.

you will not find is because you know you have made up bullshit, twisted someones words to fit your own arguments. now people have called your bluff you dont have a fucking clue what to do.

i say again: find me the exact quote of what you are alledging john to have said.

It was from last year and I cant be arsed looking for it.And Mr.68 has already owned upto the fact he said it so if thats the biggest gripe you can find stay out of it.
Nobody but you it seems doesn't know the stupid statement was said.

[Im_Spartacus]

Go and look for it yourself.

spineless.

you attack someone for something they are supposed to have said, but when challenged to provide evidence you say "look for it yourself"? fucking hell man sort your head out.

you will not find is because you know you have made up bullshit, twisted someones words to fit your own arguments. now people have called your bluff you dont have a fucking clue what to do.

i say again: find me the exact quote of what you are alledging john to have said.

I can't be arsed searching for it either but John did say it, along the lines of "Hughes is the best manager in the world for Manchester City at this time"